The light limiting growth management method

priv_sim

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After everything grows in, I'll try to reduce 4 T5 24w lamps to only 2 lamps in my 14G aquarium. I hope HC will have enough light for staying healthy.
 

Tom Barr

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You should be able to grow HC just fine in a 14 gal with only ! single 24 W bulb.
If not, you are not doing somethign right.

Regards,
Tom Barr
 

priv_sim

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I guess reflectors is the "problem", it looks darker with 2 24w and no reflectors than 3 15w with reflectors on 2 of those lamps. Anyway now growth is fantastic, HC after allmost 1 week is sending new shooters like crazy, and bubbles like Sprite.
 

jonny_ftm

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priv_sim;47305 said:
I guess reflectors is the "problem", it looks darker with 2 24w and no reflectors than 3 15w with reflectors on 2 of those lamps. Anyway now growth is fantastic, HC after allmost 1 week is sending new shooters like crazy, and bubbles like Sprite.

Yet it's not the light limitation growth we talk about here. Only one 24W or less would be more suited to talk about light limiting
 

SuperColey1

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Great article Tom. I have nothing to add. lol :)

I am currently use LED at about the 0.6WPG average ( lights programmed on a stagger through the 9 hours) with the central hour maxing out at a massive 1.11WPG and the first and last hours being a lowly 0.22WPG.

Only Crypts, anubias and ferns (many varieties of each) yet they grow at a decent rate, algae is minimal and fish look great. No CO2 injected and teeny amount of macro added as and when I think it is needed :)

AC
 

Tom Barr

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LED lighting will be something harder to deal with when comparing, some are terrible, some are brighter, some have adjustments and we can increase brightness, some have different color temps etc.
It's going to make comparing light harder.

Regards,
Tom Barr
 

Philosophos

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Hi SuperColey, LTNS

Do you have any PAR info on those LED's? Your own or bookmarked otherwise?
 

SuperColey1

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nope no PAR info. have no access to a meter :) when I was injecting CO2 and ading ferts daily the plants were growing faster with 35W LED than with 48W flouro :) Hope that helps.

Tom - I agree in a way. some LEDs are pretty bad. Nearly every batch you get even though you buy a specific K (mine are 5500K) will have a couple that look slightly yellower or bluer.

AC
 

Tom Barr

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I'm considering some for a reef tank, but I can still test and try them on a 60 gallon cube of mine for a few days first, measure etc.

Too blue though, not any choice with color temps, either no blues, all whites, or both or all blue.
I'd rather have all whites, then maybe a few blues/reds for color.

I'd also like something like a dimmer switch, this would make it much easier to dial in the right amount of light with less energy(they use less energy to adjust the light).
Instead, I have to adjust the distance/height of the fixture and cannot adjust the power now using T5's and PC lights.

I no longer use HQI/MH's.

Still, LED's will eventually provide the ideal low power use for planted tanks no matter what type of set up you might have.
Regards,
Tom Barr
 

shoggoth43

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Are you talking prebuild or DIY? Most of the DIY for reefs I see some mix of blue white and then they dial one or the other up/down until they get the color balance they want. They also seem to vary the wattage of the LEDs in question. I don't usually see this on any of the production level systems though unless you count maybe the Solaris system which isn't available any more. ( I'm not sure if it gave you quite the level of control you were talking about )

I may have to mess around with the 1W and 3W LEDs at some point and maybe a PAR meter and just see what kind of lighting we can get with these. 1W LEDs are usually a lot cheaper to get, but the drivers can/will add up quickly and the strobing effect gets out of hand pretty badly unless you get some distance to the water surface in my experience. I'd guess at least a6-8" is needed to help with that.

Still, I could see the use of a three dimmer system to get your color balance. Whites / reds / blues Even better would be a way to independently ramp those up and down for a 24 hour effect.

-
S


Tom Barr;47820 said:
I'm considering some for a reef tank, but I can still test and try them on a 60 gallon cube of mine for a few days first, measure etc.

Too blue though, not any choice with color temps, either no blues, all whites, or both or all blue.
I'd rather have all whites, then maybe a few blues/reds for color.

I'd also like something like a dimmer switch, this would make it much easier to dial in the right amount of light with less energy(they use less energy to adjust the light).
Instead, I have to adjust the distance/height of the fixture and cannot adjust the power now using T5's and PC lights.

I no longer use HQI/MH's.

Still, LED's will eventually provide the ideal low power use for planted tanks no matter what type of set up you might have.
Regards,
Tom Barr
 

SuperColey1

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Tom you can buy LEDs in any K you want wthin reason. there are warm whites (3000Kish) then the bright whites (5500K) there are also reds, greens, yellow, blues etc.

There are also ones that have the spectrum of red green and blue on one star. Most of the current controllers are dimmable so if you know a bit about electronics then thats an option. I'm not however. lol mine was my first soldering attempt. lol

AC
 

fablau

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jonny_ftm;47085 said:
Here's my 12gal, 0.9wpg tank, full of CO2 mist, 185gph filter, 3ppm PO4/week, 15ppm NO3/week, 6.5ml TPN/week and soon some DTPA. I'm lean on NO3 but it works well to manage less waterchanges.

P. Helferi was recently completely rearranged in more spaced plantlets. They should soon evolve as a large flower better looking then when densely planted. Glosso on the right is carpetting slowly but securely and without any melting despite its very dark situation, far from light. Glosso is also getting tons of CO2 mist and it perls nicely. Rotala Wallichii is dense, red and with many side shoots. I never retop it, only trim and throw away the tops.






Here's how it looked before trimming the P. Helferi, really dense. That's 0.9wpg, no PAR meter though, but should be very low PAR




When P. Helferi grows again and the glosso finishes carpetting, it should look much better


Jonny, your tank is great with such a low light! I would be curious to know your CO2 level and your dosing schedule. I have a 75gl tank with 120W lights and I have never been able to grow gloss well, I really thought was due to lack of light but I see here that's probably now the case! I am most likely lacking something else... I will wait for your thoughts, thanks!

Fab.
 

feh

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With all this said about lower light lets say you want a slow grower such as a moss or something near the top of the tank and to maintain a reasonable amount of light in the entire tank with a single bulb or 2 bulbs it would need to be placed on top of the tank or say 4 inches from the top. Would it be better to raise the lights to 12 inches and run more bulbs to maintain the same amount of light to prevent algae growing in plants near the top of the tank since the intensity would be greater closer to the light?
 

Tom Barr

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SuperColey1;47838 said:
Tom you can buy LEDs in any K you want wthin reason. there are warm whites (3000Kish) then the bright whites (5500K) there are also reds, greens, yellow, blues etc.

There are also ones that have the spectrum of red green and blue on one star. Most of the current controllers are dimmable so if you know a bit about electronics then thats an option. I'm not however. lol mine was my first soldering attempt. lol

AC

Hi, thanks, we have some spectrual output data these days and the LED's look pretty good as far plants............as far aesthetics, as well for a number of brands.
Still, we do not have a pre made fixture that meets the requirements I have.

I would greatly prefer such a pre made fixture with a dimmer and nice appearance.
 

Tom Barr

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feh;65465 said:
With all this said about lower light lets say you want a slow grower such as a moss or something near the top of the tank and to maintain a reasonable amount of light in the entire tank with a single bulb or 2 bulbs it would need to be placed on top of the tank or say 4 inches from the top. Would it be better to raise the lights to 12 inches and run more bulbs to maintain the same amount of light to prevent algae growing in plants near the top of the tank since the intensity would be greater closer to the light?

Yes, you also get a better more even spread of lower intensity this vs settting the fixture right on the water's surface.
 

fablau

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How do you deal guys with high light demanding plants like glossostigma? I had to double my light intensity (from 120w to 240w on a 75gl tank) to make it spread on the ground!

I am curious to hear your thoughts. Thanks.

Fab.
 

Hallen

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I grow glosso with a single T5 bulb hanging high above the tank, light should be around 50 maybe 60 umol according to hoppy's chart. I have no trouble keeping it low or making it spread, they do tend to go upwards when Co2 is not high enough. Would make a pic but I pulled it all out yesterday, making room for the Elatine hydropiper which'll grow with even less light.
 

fablau

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That's very interesting, thank you for the info. I have tried for 2 years making it spread, increasing Co2 very much, increasing fertilizers, etc, but no luck. Then I decided to double my light and now it grows well! How high is your tank? Mine is about 20 inches, maybe it is a matter of water depth.

My experience with glossostigma is perfectly described by this article:

http://www.freshwateraquariumplants.com/plantprofiles/glossotigma.html


Thank you again.
 

Tom Barr

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And yet is grows just fine at 40 micromols here as does HC:

mossrock26th.jpg


redone70micromollight.jpg


My tank with same light PAR:
frontedgepruning.jpg


Gloss is not a high light plant really, it's rather easy to grow and should be mowed after it gets more than 3 cm tall.

Folks might try this once and are too impatient for the weed to grow back, but it does, takes 2-3 weeks, but it does.