This site is supported by the advertisements on it, please disable your AdBlocker so we can continue to provide you with the quality content you expect.
  1. We are after as many aquarium plant images that we can get, doing so will assist us in completing the aquarium plant database.

    https://barrreport.com/threads/aquatic-plant-images-wanted.14374/
    Dismiss Notice

Rainbows And Plants...

Discussion in 'Journals' started by Rmerriett, Jan 11, 2018.

  1. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Yes, iam looking into getting an additional light. Most of my plants are low light, but i do have some medium light plants. Money is limited so i have to space out upgrades over time. I really want to get this reactor going and hope the plants hang on until i can get more lighting. The cerges reactor is based on Jason Kings. It was the only one i could find with a list of parts ect. I really need to know if the eheim is going to be enough, or what gph pump would work.
     
  2. Greggz

    Greggz Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    448
    Likes Received:
    572
    Local Time:
    6:52 PM
    I think that is a hard question to answer. So many variables.

    As a frame of reference, my Cerges is built with a 20" filter (larger than most), and is driven by a Rena XP4 (Filstar XL) which is rated at 450G/Hour flow. I keep very little media in that filter to keep the flow rate high and more constant. Works perfect for me. No bubbles ever.

    I run two other filters with full media in addition to that one.
     
  3. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Wow, based on that ill need a seperate pump for sure. Ill try to get one i can adjust the flow. The eheim ia only rated for 264gph and the reactor would reduce it even more.
     
  4. Kyalgae

    Kyalgae Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2016
    Messages:
    347
    Likes Received:
    234
    Local Time:
    1:52 PM
    An eheim 2217 is only 20 watts of pump. My vote is for more powah! More power, more better.
     
  5. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Im looking for reliability and at a price i can affoard. I was hoping the 2217 and the tidal 110 hob would be enough. Two tidal 110's i have now need constant cleaning which is a pain and too much surface agitation. I need to keep the co2 in the tank. I also have a powerhead that pushes quite a bit of water. I have plenty of flow for a 90 gal. If i get a pump to drive the reactor i can spend my money on another light and hold off for now on the filter. I want both right now, but my kids need to eat lol.
     
  6. Greggz

    Greggz Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    448
    Likes Received:
    572
    Local Time:
    6:52 PM
    Surface agitation is good. You need O2 in the tank.

    In particular, Rainbows are very sensitive to low oxygen levels. Most come from rivers, streams, and fast flowing water. You want to keep a good level of oxygen during the CO2 period. CO2 is cheap. I wouldn't try to skimp on it.

    And in general good O2 levels help you keep a clean healthy happy tank.
     
  7. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Amonia. 0ppm
    Nitrite 0ppm
    Ph 8.2
    Nitrate. 80+ ppm. Test is candy red. Could be much higher
    Gh. 7
    Po4 10+ ppm

    Ok, here is where I'm at. Above is todays tests, which include everything I am able to test for. You'll also see pictures of the state of my plants. Not good at all. It's o.k. though as this is part of the learning. I thought again of what I'm trying to accomplish. A polished bright tank, with a variety of colorful plants.

    Ive done some reading today tring to figure out out why my plants are not doing well, and i have a lot of brown algea. I have good co2, lots of ferts using El, and low-med light (low at the substrate). My nitrates are very high as are my phosphates. Im using flourish as my source of trace elements + GH booster as my tap is softened.

    I am concerned with my no3 and po4 levels being so high. Im reading a lot of conflicting advice on weather or not these elements in high amounts is bad for plants and can cause algea/stunted growth. My consensus is, yes it can if you dont have enough light and /or co2 so the plants can grow and use those nutrients. So a wild guess here lol. I have too much nutrients for the amount of light im providing. Co2 is more of a constant, as long as there is plenty and the fish are not suffocating.

    I think i really need to dive hard into my lighting. I need more to accomplish my goal no doubt. Im not real sure how i will accomplish that yet. I will be reaching out to the community here to learn more about this. My one and only light is a 48" current satalite + pro. In the meantime should i increase my photo period and or reduce ferts (kno3).

    FB_IMG_1519053339046.jpg

    FB_IMG_1519053344596.jpg

    FB_IMG_1519053349556.jpg
     
    #27 Rmerriett, Feb 19, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2018
    Greggz likes this.
  8. Greggz

    Greggz Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    448
    Likes Received:
    572
    Local Time:
    6:52 PM
    My guess is that the single Current Satellite Pro has you at low lighting. I mentioned I saw a video where someone recorded 35 PAR at 16", and you are deeper than that. The other issue is that you have an 18" wide tank, and LED's in general are very directional and have poor spread. You may have spots in the tank with very, very low par.

    And it's not that you couldn't do well with that. But you would need to stick to low light plants (crypts, swords, anubias, ferts, etc.). Not many stems will thrive with light that low. And in general, yes, with low light you need far fewer ferts. Those plants simply don't consume EI dosing levels.

    In my opinion, given your stated goals of having lots of colorful plants, it will require more light than you are currently providing.

    And I have to add, I like your calm attitude and patience. Very few come right out of the gate and get it all right. Takes some trial and error, we all go through it (and it never ends!!).
     
    Fissh likes this.
  9. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Trust me, its hard to not get overly frustrated as my results so far have not been good at all. But i do understand i need to go through the learning process. The more failures i have, the more knowledge ill gain. Im at a bit of a roadblock with the lighting. Will the plants i have grow in medium to high light? I can not affoard another $300 light, so would say adding a finnex planted light work? It worries me as they are expensive, but there have been many reports of them not lasting due to bad power supplies/quality control. The other options out there as far as led goes are even less light than what I have now. Going to t5 and scapping the leds is another huge investment i can not affoard right now, and is counter to what i want. I want to be able to increase/decrease intensity without having to use beer bottles to adjust the height of the lights.

    On a side note, before i started dosing ferts my crypts, ferns ect where not doing well even then. Worse in fact. Im am scratching my head quite a bit trying to decide where to go next. I can not find a simple planted light, that I can adjust intensity only. Without all the lightning storms and cloudy day stuff that fits my budget. Questions i need to ask in the lighting forum i suppose.
     
    Greggz likes this.
  10. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Frustrating update. Its been a rough week for the tank. Ill start with the bad news..... i broke my GLA regulator so I have no co2 right now until i can fix it. I was reaching behind the co2 tank to plug something in and tipped it over. It landed right on the bubble counter and ultimately it broke off. I contacted GLA and Marco was very helpful at first. He was going to get me a hose fitting to replace the bubble counter, so i can then use an inline counter to help prevent it from happening again. However he just stopped responding to my emails. Still waiting very impatiently. I have also stopped using ferts due to this in combination with the realization that my light was just not enough to warrent it. One satalite plus pro puts me in low light/very low light. I am getting plants with stunted, melting, yellowing, and brown algea covered plants. Looks terrible. Im still dosing seachem flourish and GH booster and hopefully they will hang on for a bit.

    Hopefull news. Ive been talking to Greggz and immortal about increasing my lighting. It turns out Fluval just realeased there newest light, the Plant 3.0 no more than two weeks ago. I went ahead and jumped on it, and received the light two days ago. I am now using both lights and my best guess is, it put me right where i want to be, in the medium light range. It has helped remove the dark/under lit areas of my tank and its been awesome viewing my beautiful bows. It's very unfortunate the co2 broke at the same time and i cant wait to get it going again to see how the plants and algea respond. I may consider getting another 3.o in the future and run all 3 lights.

    Sort of funny news... my dog found my container of Fluval bug bites fish food. Opened it, and ate it all. This morning I noticed shes growing a dorsal fin!

    FB_IMG_1519829905820.jpg

    FB_IMG_1519829917432.jpg

    FB_IMG_1519829894511.jpg
     
    Nikolyator and Greggz like this.
  11. Immortal

    Immortal Lifetime Member
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2017
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    19
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Good to hear you were able to get one of the new Fluval lights. Really hoping for you that it produces a better spectrum for the plants. I likely will be replacing my array of lights this weekend with a pair of Radion XR15fw lights (fingers crossed it does what I expect). Unfortunate about your CO2 rig. Certainly something I worry about with different setups as many of them use very small threaded parts.
     
    Rmerriett likes this.
  12. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Wow, i just looked those up. For that price they better make you dinner and do the laundry to! Marco at GLA finally got back to me and we are skipping the bubble counter replacement ($75 part). Instead hes sending me a hose attachment, and I'm going to run an inline counter. Should make that much less likely to happen again. May consider getting a flow meter in the future and skip the counter all together.
     
    Greggz likes this.
  13. Immortal

    Immortal Lifetime Member
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2017
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    19
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Agreed on all accounts :)
    Yes they are expensive - probably won't be getting steak every nite and I'm sure laundry is out.
    I run a Fluval brand separate bubble counter which IMO is a better way to go than more equipment attached to the heavy tank.
    And bubble counter is actually kinda a funny statement - more of a stream indicator. Flow meter would be a better option.
     
    Rmerriett and Greggz like this.
  14. Greggz

    Greggz Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    448
    Likes Received:
    572
    Local Time:
    6:52 PM
    Hey I replied to your PM before I read your latest posts.

    Doesn't look quite as bad as you described. Give it a little time with the new extra light. Still have no clue what your PAR might be, but it must be better.

    If you are worried about the N/P levels, do an extra water change and reset the tank a bit. And you were without CO2 for awhile, which takes a little time to recover from.

    Do you know what your pH drop is???
     
    Rmerriett likes this.
  15. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    My ph out of the tap is 8+, and when im using co2 it drops to 7.4-7.8. Im only using the API test wich i know isnt that accurate. That drop is with room for more, as the drop checker is green green.
     
  16. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Sort of an off topic question here. Im looking into getting an inline uv clarifier. I do have a 24w submersible (green killing machine), but the bulb is burned out. At $30 a bulb that only lasts a few months at most, im not happy at all with that. Id like to run it on a closed system with my co2 reactor, and the pump im using is rated at max flow of 185gph. A rough guess of what im getting with the reactor is half that, lets say 90gph. So my question is: is an inline steralizer going to slow the flow even more to where id need a bigger pump? I know slower flow for a uv clarifier is better, but im more concerned about having enough for the reactor. The second question is how much watage do i need for my 90g tank. Would a 9w bulb be enough for say 90-100gph on a 90 gal.

    Any help here is appreciated.
     
  17. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Well today my co2 is fixed, and I installed a 18w pond max uv sterilizer. Cleaned up under cabinet. Im running the Sicce pump (185gph) in a closed system to flow the water to the co2 reactor, and then to the sterilizer. Now to get things stable with the co2, and added light. I kind of feel like im starting over.

    FB_IMG_1520280033927.jpg
     
    Immortal and Greggz like this.
  18. Fissh

    Fissh New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2017
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    5
    Local Time:
    1:52 PM
    Wow what an adventure :)
    Glad the point got made that the current lighting would be very low on a 90g... the deeper the tank the pricier lighting becomes, even just to get you at decent par for low light plants...

    Just a note... the fert picture you have csmb... but you keep mentioning flourish???? I would get rid of the flourish and dose the csmb, they are both micro/ trace formulas. Also in classic EI dosing, flourish would be dosed on alternate days as macros... ex NPK MWF trace TTS sun wc and gH booster

    Ei can also be modified, it doesn’t need to be dosed daily... dosing depends on 1)co2 and 2)lighting
    You can add all the co2 you want, but If your lighting isn’t high enough to have the plants use up the nutrients you shouldn’t be dosing such high levels. Try cutting back to twice a week dosing... Sunday wc gH mon macro tues micro wed break thurs macro fri micro Sát break... you can even go down to once a week if need be... also double check the amounts you’ve been adding, that seems really high for phosphate accumulation (on the assumption of 50%wc)... also check your tap as a source of nitrates and phosphates
     
    Rmerriett likes this.
  19. Rmerriett

    Rmerriett Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2018
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    36
    Local Time:
    12:52 PM
    Yes i have both CSMB and flourish, but I am only dosing flourish until i empty the bottle. Then ill start using the CSMB. It is amazing how well the lfs talked up the the Current light, and how I fell for it. The Iast time i was there i mentioned it to them. Adding the second light has made a huge difference visually, but time will tell if its enough to grow plants well. I have a feeling ill be buying a 3rd light.
     
    Greggz likes this.
  20. Greggz

    Greggz Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    448
    Likes Received:
    572
    Local Time:
    6:52 PM
    My experience in general has been that most LFS don't know much about planted tanks. Not knocking them for that, and I'm sure there are exceptions, but most just don't have any experience with a fully planted tank.
     
    Fissh and Immortal like this.
Loading...
Tags:

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice