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Pink Mayaca?

Discussion in 'General Plant Topics' started by dapellegrini, Nov 26, 2006.

  1. dapellegrini

    dapellegrini Lifetime Charter Member
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    My LFS got in a whole bunch of Mayaca about 4 weeks ago. When it first arrived it was completely pink. A pale-pink, but no signs of green/silver. I finally decided to pick some up today and it is now completely green/silver.

    Any ideas on how to get it to go pink again? Anyone have experience with this plant?

    Here it is newly set in the tank:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    TIA,

    Dan
     
  2. colonel

    colonel Guru Class Expert

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    I dunno about the pink.... I my self have never seen that. Different plants change many different colors due to the environment they are in.... and that im sure was the case....

    However now the plants your bought are the color they are because they are not in the best of shape.... that plant needs some trace fert... more so Iron. It usually a bright green plant all the way through the growing tips.... gets like that when it's not getting enough iron.

    However Im not saying that your not adding enough.... just that you bought them a bit starved... if conditions are good in your tank I do believe you are going to see them doing another magic color change to an all green plant ;)
     
  3. dapellegrini

    dapellegrini Lifetime Charter Member
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    Here is an image link of Mayaca Pink in the wild from a quick google search (the color in the store was like the tips all the way down, without all the dirt / muck):

    http://darwin.bangor.ac.uk/images/Mayaca%20fluviatilis/3%20Mayaca%20fluviatilis%20DS%20900%20Maquenque.JPG

    http://darwin.bangor.ac.uk/images/Mayaca%20fluviatilis/1%20Mayaca%20fluviatilis%20DS%20900%20Maquenque.JPG

    Ya, I don't think it was really happy at the store. I have seen plants that are normally green go redish/cooper on the ends in my tank, so we will how this one fairs. The only thing I do not want to have to do is soften my water... The pink color was very nice.
     
  4. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    I've collected this plant in wild and the red is a sign of N stress.
    I've also found it in FL in Lake Annie in Archbold Research station.

    Many plants turn quite red in nature, not because they are happy, rather, they have little Chlorophyll which requires lots of Nitrogen to make.

    Do not make such mistakes in assuming what is in nature is the best environment for plants, clearly that is NOT the case in agriculture/horticulture.

    Farms are far far from nature.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  5. dapellegrini

    dapellegrini Lifetime Charter Member
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    Well, that settles that then. Green it will be.

    Thanks for the info Tom.
     
  6. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Well, here's an interesting bit of info, it's referring only to this species plant, Dave Spencer's done some other work that suggest NO3 limitation can cause red color appearnaces for4 the exact same reason as this reference.

    CSA

    Influence of Temperature, Light and Nutrient Limitation on Anthocyanin Content of Potamogeton gramineus L
    Ksander, GG; Spencer, DF
    Aquatic Botany AQBODS, Vol. 38, No. 4, p 357-367, December 1990. 3 fig, 7 tab, 14 ref.

    Folks read this and think they can have redder plants unfortunately.
    We are talking about 3x as much nearly as a 1000 w MH light over a 20 gallon at 12" distance.

    We get up near this range at the 1000w over a 20 gal.
    So it is simply not practical vs natural systems.
    Explaining the details is what gets folks all mucked up, they see one thing and do not take ino consideration the other factors and just how much or how little they have vs nature.

    Other cases are river systems that are replentished continuely at very low concentrations of nutrients.

    Another issue: plant species-species differences, some are very easily changed with NO3, some are not. You have to be specific about what species you are talking about.

    The nutrients never run out and are maintained at extremely low levels.
    The reservior or nutrients is huge, and many orders of maginitude higher than any aquarium.

    So folks measure low or near absent nutrients in natural systems, then assume that is what plants prefer.

    I spoke to Kasslemeann about this once, she gave lots and lots of data about the water column in her travels to find Echinordorus plants in her talk we heard.

    I ask her if she measured the soil/pore water, she said "no". If the plants are not able to get anything from the water, they will try and get it from the substrate.

    Seems strange to try and support a contention without looking at a rather obvious source of nutrients. She's smart, but appeared to overlook such assumptions(I've done such assumptions, but could not explain things in other cases and found my hypothesis to false, so I make a new hypothesis) and having gone with whatever is in nature is best. It's basic procedure to do soil analysis for wetland plants. Often there is little in the water column. It does not suggest presence nor absense of plants, there are many lakes with no nutrients measured in the water and no plants, likewise....... the same can be true for lakes/streams etc with plants...........

    Humans would never have form cilvilizations is that was the case.
    That may ior may not be so great depending on your view, but the fact remains: what we do with aquriums is not in hardly any way related to nature but rather far more related to horticulture.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  7. dapellegrini

    dapellegrini Lifetime Charter Member
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    Good points. I was not assuming that the natural form was the happiest, but instead the form I first saw the plant in the store when it was new (being unfamiliar with it). A quick google search and the only similar color I could find in the pictures online were the ones I posted up from wild growth.
     
  8. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Don't fret none, I talk in general terms with folks.
    There are common things folks repeat such as Fe, high light, and now, more likely, low NO3 about red intensity and color changes in plants.

    Rotala and Ludwigia are the most common plant genera that exhibit this color changing ability.

    Try them out and try less light + good dosing and lower NO3, this is best done using a balanced , rather high fish load and low light with CO2.

    If you use high light, then it becomes much more work to dose KNO3 at a low level due to increase demand. Fish feeding is relatively easy and adds daily or 2-3x daily etc N sources.

    So you can get away with less N dosing and less worry about running out for too long.

    You still dose K+, Traces and PO4 in most cases.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
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