Loc-Line advice?

Jim Miller

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Never used Loc-Line and I'm placing an order. Tank will be a 90g with an Eheim 2078 rated at 450gph with 5/8" hoses.

I'll have 1.5" bulkheads so that won't be a restriction. I plan on two locline outlets each with a flare output. Although I'll run 3/4" all the way to each flare it looks like I'll have to step down to 1/2" before attaching the fans. The reason for the 1/2" fans is to keep the velocity up.

Should I use the 1.25" or the 2.5" flares for this amount of flow? Or should I go for the 3/4x3" flares and skip the 1/2" flares altogether?

Thanks

Jim
 
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Tom Barr

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Skip the fans, if you want more spread, then use Tee's.
Velocity will be higher with less restriction.
Canister filters are VERY WEAK, so they have little back pressure.

Regards,
Tom Barr
 

Jim Miller

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So would you recommend just starting with the bare 3/4 lines?

Any suggestion for a very quiet pump I could use for an additional flow circuit to parallel the Eheim?

Thanks!

Jim
 

Jim Miller

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Perhaps I'm barking up the wrong tree. What would be a separate filter that I could use in combination with a suitable pump that would be:

1. easy to maintain in a carpetted room (with fussy wife who won't tolerate spills)
2. effective at filtration
3. dead silent (my handicapped daughter has sensory issues)
4. be better at flow for a 90g

I'm not made of money but I'd rather do it right than do it over...

Thanks

Jim (i'm still looking for specs on the hobby pump)
 

Gerryd

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Hi Jim,

The rena xp models are very quiet and perform well. The magnum 350 is in my bedroom and that also is pretty quiet.

I would use 3/4 locline all the way. I used tees like Tom suggested and broke my single outlet to 3. This helps me to point them as needed.

Up to you how much water you spill, but both the rena and magnum can come with locking hoses that allow easy removal with no spillage...

I bet your lfs is using some canisters, drop by and check them out. Then shop via the web as many times you will save $.. Big al's for one...
 

Jim Miller

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Hi Gerry

Thanks for your input. My LFS has a huge integrated water system so no individual cannisters in operation that I could see. I was looking for them specifically the last time I was there.

Are you suggesting the 350 or XP units as supplements or replacements for the Eheim 2078?

All good on the 3/4".

I started Googling the Iwaki and Ocean Clear stuff that Tom has mentioned in some of his posts. Any feedback on the efficacy and sound levels of units of that ilk that would be appropriate to a 90g? I was looking at this pump: Iwaki WMD30RLXT. It does 960gph against a 4ft head. Considering that the application is a zero head (in/out at same depth) that should be plenty, perhaps too much and require a bunch of bypass. Perhaps the Iwaki WMD20RLXT would be a better choice at 540gph at 4ft. For a 90g that would represent 6 changes per hour. The WMD30 would be 16 changes per hour without bypass.

I'd really like to avoid paralllel loops if possible. If I could find components for a single loop that would do the job I'd prefer that approach.

Thanks

Jim
 
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shoggoth43

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Not to throw too big a wrench into this, but if your Eheim will handle the bioload, why not just toss in a koralia or similar to get the flow you're looking for?

-
S
 

Jim Miller

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Shoggoth

Thanks for the suggestion but I'm really trying to avoid stuff in the tank. If it's really necessary because there's no alternative then I'll have to do it. But I'd rather start out with something that would have a good chance of meeting my objectives from the start.

I spent the last two hours reading up on the Iwaki and Ocean Clear alternative. On the Iwaki there appears to be a choice of Japanese or American motors. What's up with that? It also appears that although well built they are not "silent." Perhaps silent isn't really possible with the type of power they represent.

On the Ocean Clear front I can't really figure out how to configure a single cannister that meets both mechanical and biological filtration needs. It appears that multiple cannisters are required.

It does appear that these two in combination can move a lot more water.

Thanks

Jim (still researching...)
 

Gerryd

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Jim,

Sorry. What issues are you trying to resolve? I have become confused...

I use the NC canisters and a large pump. Most larger pumps will NOT be very quiet, esp for your daughter's sensitivity...

I thought you wanted a new quieter filter, hence my original response..
 

Jim Miller

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Hi Gerry

I have no filter or aquarium yet. I have a 90g being built. It will have a 1.5" bulkhead in each of the two rear corners to act as input and output sources.

I want proper flow and filtration. It must be as close to silent as possible. It must be maintainable with a minimum of likelihood of soiling the house.

I'd also like the solution to make maximum use of the bulkheads to provide water movement rather than extra equipment in the tank.

This thread started as a "what best loclines to use" and as a result of TB's inference that flow won't be adequate due to "weak cannister pumps" I've started reconsidering all approaches.

Thanks for your help!

Jim
 

Gerryd

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Jim,

Sorry. They are Nu-Clear filters very similar to the Ocean Clear (OC) models used by Tom and others. The NC are 1" is about the only difference.

I think the OC has a model that has a builtin heater that the NC does not. The NC has a feature that allows you to 'stack' one mech or bio (must be the same) on top of one another.

I use the NC mech and bio in parallel lines run by my one pump on my 180. Is a nice option on large tanks, but is overkill for a 90 most likely.
 

shoggoth43

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Jim,

The difference in the Iwaki pumps is that the Japanese built are thought to be "better/quieter/cooler/efficient" than the US made ones. Whether this is true or not I couldn't say. By the time the Japanese ones are done being drop kicked around and generally abused in shipping on their way over I'm not sure it would make much difference but people do swear that the Japanese ones are better.

Back to the Lok-Line question, I picked up some the other day. The 3/4" size is surprisingly large. As in, I had no idea it was going to be that big. They do have a reducer splitter which goes from 3/4" down to 2 separate 1/2" feeds. This could let you have the 3/4" line without too much restriction on the smaller 1/2" lines and the added flexibility to do multiple outlets should you find you have too little flow in some areas of the tank.

Some other thoughts:

You could run a normal cannister filter with another pump inline if you need more flow. In this case you should probably just unplug the cannister and use the other pump. An eheim compact or other pump could be used for this as they are generally regarded as quiet. If possible, try to do a bucket test in the store. If you can hear the pump there, you'll definitely hear it at home.

A separate pump and cannister filter combo such as the OC and NC units would be nice, but is definitely approaching the overkill side of things. Most of the smaller, lower flow pumps use 1/2 - 3/4" inlets/outlets. You will need adapters for this, not a big issue but something to keep in mind when you go plumbing things.

You may wish to consider standpipes to reduce the potential amount of water which might come out should a hose disconnect. If you using overflows build into the tank, you can use those easily enough. Bear in mind that an outlet at the bottom of the tank will have more pressure in the pipe vs. outlets closer to the top ( as in with a standpipe or return line ). Less water to leak should it happen. Do not depend on any

Leaks/spills happen. Think about this now and plan for it. A way to attach hoses directly into your plumbing and over to the tub/sink is worth considering. Less buckets = less mess ( usually ). If for any reason you have an urge to use check valves in your plumbing, don't. They require maintenance which you aren't likely to do because of what they are and where they are probably located. They don't always work, as in they'll work fine when you're watching ( usually ) but the Great Demon Murphy will ensure that when you aren't around they'll inexplicably fail. Consider extra ball valves as shutoffs on the cannister inlet/outlets. I've snagged my eheim shutoff before and opened it while rummaging around the stand for something while the rest of the cannister was in the tub.

While you can get Wet/Dry filters to be quiet, this takes a lot more forethought and effort compared to canisters. Plan out your wiring. You don't want a tangle of wiring or a powerstrip underfoot in the stand if you can help it. Don't rule out the option of powerhead/prop pumps. They are surprisingly unobtrusive and easy to hide in plain sight. Finally, plug everything into a GFCI protected outlet, this is not optional.

Good luck and keep us posted.

-
S

Jim Miller;59385 said:
Shoggoth

Thanks for the suggestion but I'm really trying to avoid stuff in the tank. If it's really necessary because there's no alternative then I'll have to do it. But I'd rather start out with something that would have a good chance of meeting my objectives from the start.

I spent the last two hours reading up on the Iwaki and Ocean Clear alternative. On the Iwaki there appears to be a choice of Japanese or American motors. What's up with that? It also appears that although well built they are not "silent." Perhaps silent isn't really possible with the type of power they represent.

On the Ocean Clear front I can't really figure out how to configure a single cannister that meets both mechanical and biological filtration needs. It appears that multiple cannisters are required.

It does appear that these two in combination can move a lot more water.

Thanks

Jim (still researching...)
 

Jim Miller

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Shoggoth

Thanks for the suggestions. I'm currently looking at the OC340 along with a Blueline T2 to drive it. The tank is bottom drilled in two locations with 1.5" bulkheads. I suppose I could aways run a standpipe to an elevated location. Good points on the additional ball valves. Cheap insurance. Loc-line will be a learning experience it seems. I can always sell the spare bits I don't end up using to someone else in the club.

Thanks!

Jim