Left C's 40BR Journal

[Left C]

Hi

I just finished assembling the stand for my 40BR and I have two choices that I can use for pressurized CO2 diffusion. One is the 5/8" Up-Aqua Atomizer and the other is an Eheim adjustable speed needle wheel pump. Which would you suggest?

It will be plumbed inline after an Eheim 2028 Pro II and a Hydro heater. I'll be using the Eheim optional grey plastic intake and spray bar (installation kits). I have a T5HO fixture that I'll only be using the two outside bulbs. One bulb is the Giesemann Midday 6000K and the other is their Aquaflora. I'll be using Amazonia for the substrate.

Thanks,
Left C

 

[Gerryd]

Hi,

I think the atomizer will work well...I am a bit concerned that it is also after the hydor...

As long as you can give 25 psi....

Plus, the UP sticks to the outside glass and is out of the tank. No electricty either...

What version of ADA?

 

[Left C]

It is the original Amazonia.

I can give it 25 psi or more. I have several regulators to pick from.

Edit: Why are you concerned that it is after the Hydor heater?

 

[Gerryd]

Edit: Why are you concerned that it is after the Hydor heater?

Just in case the eheim is underpowered or the diameter hose to the heater is LESS than the canister. Just want to ensure the atomizer gets enough flow although I admit to having no idea if this is really an issue or not.

Just the way my mind works to think of these things...

I can give it 25 psi or more. I have several regulators to pick from.

That was pretty funny. Understatement of the year coming from you LOL

Did you buy the ada original on purpose to avoid the new type? Or did you have it put aside already? Thanks

 

[jerrybforl]

When I was building my sump and everyone was explaining to me about "head" no pun intended. I thought well if everything is inline and your not adding extra tubing that loops around then I should be ok adding things inline. Makes sense to me. From my pump I have a ball valve, riser, quick disconnect, check valve, and my atomizer. It all runs one after the other without losing extra head. There is no slack in my line therefore no loss of flow.

 

[Left C]

Just in case the eheim is underpowered or the diameter hose to the heater is LESS than the canister. Just want to ensure the atomizer gets enough flow although I admit to having no idea if this is really an issue or not.

Just the way my mind works to think of these things...

I understand what you mean. It is OK. The Eheim 2028 uses 16mm or 5/8" ID tubing and everything fits that same size tubing.

The pump output of 2028 is 277 gph which, just guessing, may be around an actual 200 gph from some of the lists that I've seen as in this canister spec list. The Eheim needle wheel pump has an adjustable rating from 211 gph up to well past what I would need. It could supply the added pull that I may need to get good flow. I could tweak it as needed. I do have a 5/8" UV that I could add, but I haven't decided if I will use it. If I use all this stuff and keep it under the stand, I should end up with some bends and most likely some right angle bends too. This is another reason where the pump may be helpful. It can help to pull this stuff along. I'll have to plum the pump last because we can't have a mist going through the Hydor inline heater or an UV sterilizer, I don't believe.

When I ordered my Up-Aqua Atomizers, I ordered the 12/16mm and the 16mm/22mm versions. There is one for a 2217 and the other is for a 2028. I can't find the 16/22mm version that I need to go with the 5/8" tubing above. It is here somewhere. I found the 12/16mm version. This is OK because I have an Eheim 2217 that uses 1/2" or 12mm tubing. I have a 12mm Hydor heater too. The Eheim 2217 and 2028 have similar flow rates. I could use either, I suppose. I was planning to use the 2217 with the 37g. I do have an Eheim 2213 waiting if I need some extra circulation.

It sounds crazy to have all this stuff, but I bought it a piece at a time over a few years. I started getting stuff for a 37g and then I started getting stuff for a 40BR. I have all this stuff before I have either tank set up and going. In this case, I can "rob Peter to pay Paul" so to speak with the filters and accessories since the aquarium volumes are almost the same.

I need to get something going because my 29g grow out tank is crammed full of plants that I plan on using with these aquariums.

That was pretty funny. Understatement of the year coming from you LOL

I feel like "Suitcase Jake" because I have so many.

Did you buy the ada original on purpose to avoid the new type? Or did you have it put aside already? Thanks

I bought the Amazonia before the II version came out and I set it aside for this use. I also have three bags of Black Flourite, but I don't want to use it for this project.




Below is the "Moss Arch 'Scape" that I was going to put in the 37g. It is just too narrow to do something like this with the large driftwood that I have that makes up the arch. I'm going to put it in the 40BR instead. The aquarium that Amano used for this 'scape is similar in size to a 40BR anyway. This came from the Jan-Mar 2011 issue of The Aquatic Gardener. Below is whole article, but the 'scape that I am trying to copy is on the first two images.

 

[Left C]

When I was building my sump and everyone was explaining to me about "head" no pun intended. I thought well if everything is inline and your not adding extra tubing that loops around then I should be ok adding things inline. Makes sense to me. From my pump I have a ball valve, riser, quick disconnect, check valve, and my atomizer. It all runs one after the other without losing extra head. There is no slack in my line therefore no loss of flow.

Thanks JJ. I'll see if I can run everything in a straight line. If I add a probably un-needed UV, I may have some bends that I don't like. Then this is where some help from the needle wheel pump may come in.

 

[Left C]

I got industrious and worked on the 40BR yesterday evening. I plumbed everything and I assembled a two stage regulator.

The 40BR has:

• an Eheim 2028 Pro II filter
• a 36w UV sterilzer
• a Hydor 300w inline heater
• an Eheim adjustable flow needle wheel pump for CO2 mist

running inline

The two stage regulator is/has:

• a Victor VTS253A-320
• a Burkert solenoid
• an Ideal 52-1-12 needle valve
• a Parker 1psig check valve between the needle valve and the bubble counter
• a JBJ bubble counter
• a Clippard inline check valve
• Tygon lab tubing 1/8" x 1/4"

I checked my regulator assembly for leaks and I didn't see any.

I filled the 2028's media trays with the appropriate media and rinsed it. I'll let it dry overnight.

I'll hook everything up after lunch today and check for leaks. Everything fits inside that "cheap" stand even the CO2 tank. The only bad thing about the stand is that it only has one door, but it is wide enough to allow access to the equipment. I can remove everything rather easily for maintenance, which is very important to me.

I'm glad that I was rather industrious yesterday. If it doesn't leak, maybe I can plant it by evening. We'll see. I just hope that I don't have to deal with any leaks.

I went in this direction because I couldn't find the 5/8" Up-Aqua Atomizer. If this doesn't work, I can go with either the 1/2" Up-Aqua Atomizer or rob the AM1000 reactor from the grow out tank.

 

[Left C]

I'll be using Amazonia original. I have some substrate amenities that I am considering placing underneath the Amazonia on start-up. This is what I have:

• Activated Filter Carbon
• Leonardite
• Canadian Sphagnum Peat Moss
• Osmocote Plus
• Dolomite
• Potash
• Ferrous Sulfate
• Seachem Flourish Tabs
• Wonder-Gro Root+ aquarium plant substrate tablets

Will any of these products help the Amazonia initially?

Thanks for your help. I don't remember reading about anyone adding anything extra other than some mulm from an established aquarium and maybe some carbon..

 

[tjbuege]

I filled the 2028's media trays with the appropriate media and rinsed it. I'll let it dry overnight.

Hi Left C,

This is very similar to a setup I'm considering. I've never used Canister filters before (still reading up on them), but I'm curious, what is "appropriate media" specifically?

 

[Left C]

Hi Left C,

This is very similar to a setup I'm considering. I've never used Canister filters before (still reading up on them), but I'm curious, what is "appropriate media" specifically?

Hi tjbuege

I used the media that came with the 2028 plus a bag a zeolite to help with ammonia on startup. The 2028 has 3 media baskets. The bottom basket contains Eheim's Mech which is somewhat like macaroni for mechanical filtration topped by a blue coarse filter pad. The middle baskets only contain's Eheim's Substrat Pro. The top basket also contains Substrat Pro topped by a thin bag of Marineland's White Diamond Ammonia-Neutralizing Crystals which is zeolite followed by a white fine filter pad. No carbon pads were included with the kit. If one was included, I would of used it. The Substrat Pro is like Coco Puffs, but they are a creamy white color. This is used for biological filtration.

I've had this filter since 2005 or 2006 when there was a very good sale on them as a complete kit including media and the installation sets 1 and 2 for the intake and an output spraybar. I'm just now using it. I've been buying equipment every now and then when I had some extra money. I didn't think that this filter would become dated and replaced by something better.

I've read a few filtration threads concerning planted aquarium media about only using lava rock like you can get from Home Depot as the media. Some people use pads for mechanical filtration and some do not. The lava rock is broken into small and placed in the canister filter. This provides biological and some mechanical filtration. It is said to last a very long time between cleanings. This is only the jest of it, so to speak. There is much more to it than this very brief summary.

 

[Left C]

I got industrious and worked on the 40BR yesterday evening. I plumbed everything and I assembled a two stage regulator.

The 40BR has:

• an Eheim 2028 Pro II filter
• a 36w UV sterilzer
• a Hydor 300w inline heater
• an Eheim adjustable flow needle wheel pump for CO2 mist

running inline

The two stage regulator is/has:

• a Victor VTS253A-320
• a Burkert solenoid
• an Ideal 52-1-12 needle valve
• a Parker 1psig check valve between the needle valve and the bubble counter
• a JBJ bubble counter
• a Clippard inline check valve
• Tygon lab tubing 1/8" x 1/4"

I checked my regulator assembly for leaks and I didn't see any.

I filled the 2028's media trays with the appropriate media and rinsed it. I'll let it dry overnight.

I'll hook everything up after lunch today and check for leaks. Everything fits inside that "cheap" stand even the CO2 tank. The only bad thing about the stand is that it only has one door, but it is wide enough to allow access to the equipment. I can remove everything rather easily for maintenance, which is very important to me.

I'm glad that I was rather industrious yesterday. If it doesn't leak, maybe I can plant it by evening. We'll see. I just hope that I don't have to deal with any leaks.

I went in this direction because I couldn't find the 5/8" Up-Aqua Atomizer. If this doesn't work, I can go with either the 1/2" Up-Aqua Atomizer or rob the AM1000 reactor from the grow out tank.

My 40BR is awesome. That Eheim pump is the ticket! I have terrific flow. I put a piece of intake filter foam that is about the size of my fist in the aquarium that is completely full with water. It makes a clockwise lap around the tank every 30 seconds.

I'm using Eheim's optional clear grey installation kits. I put the spraybar kit on the left wall. I added an extra section so that the spraybar runs across the whole left side. The intake kit is also on the left side. The spraybar is made of 4 sections that have 4 holes in each section. This arrangement allows a nice circular rotation. This should give me good distribution, but we'll see when I add the driftwood.

My CO2 is plumbed into the adjustable flow Eheim needle wheel. I don't get a lot of mist or anything like that. I just see a few errant bubbles coming out. This is with the bubble rate running so fast that I can't count them. I am really impressed with it. There is no noise either. I have the pump running about 75% of wide open. Its rated flow range is from 211 to 713 gph. I'll turn down the bubble rate after it is planted.

This is the order that the water flow goes through: intake, 2028 filter, UV sterilizer placed in a horizontal position, Hydor heater in a vertical position, needle wheel pump and spraybar

With all the bends, I'm sure that the flow would be very weak without the benefit of the Eheim needle wheel pump to help push the water through. I used a lot of Eheim's 5/8" tubing, maybe 16 feet. The flow crosses back and forth from end to end with gentle bends. There is only one 90° bend which is made using a Coralife tubing elbow.

I have the regulator set on 10 psi and this is fine. I could probably go down to 5 psi and still be OK. I'd just have to readjust my bubble count.

I'm going to let it run all night with just water in the aquarium. Tomorrow, I'll drain it and plant it.

I have a 4x39w T5HO fixture and I'm planning on using just the two outside bulbs. I have Giesemann 6000K's and Aquafloras plus the stock 10,000K bulbs. I may play around with it and see if I like a 50/50 mix of 6000K and Aquaflora. I'll put the Aquaflora in the back to start with. If I don't like it, I could use a 6000K and a 10,000K.

All in all, I am very happy with my collection of parts used for this 40BR. The single door stand is a tiny PITA, but I'll have to live with it. I used enough tubing so that I can easily pull everything out from inside the stand.

 

[tjbuege]

Thanks, Left C, for the details on media used in your Ehiem. It's helps me understand the setup better. I've been reading as much as I can find, and trying to soak it all in.

 

[tjbuege]

Left C,

Can you post some pictures? As the saying goes... they can be worth 1,000 words.

 

[Left C]

Can do Tim. I want to plant it now. I'll get some pictures either later or in a few days.

 

[Left C]

I let it run all night and there were no leaks. I'm going to drain it, add the Amazonia and plant it.

 

[Biollante]

Awesome Tank Under Construction!


Hi Left C (aka Suitcase Jake),


I have never used Amazonia original (or any other commercial substrate), but it is my impression that it is Leonardite, so I do not think there will be problem using more, it can be kind of messy, but it is good, so if you have it, I see no problem adding more.


I always like a layer of Sphagnum Peat Moss as the first layer; I also tend to mix it in as well.


If you are using Osmocote Plus (my choice), I see no need to use Seachem Flourish Tabs (nothing wrong with them) or Wonder-Gro Root+ aquarium plant substrate tablets (I have no experience with this product).


I am not sure there is any great advantage to Ferrous sulfate, but a little mixed in isn’t going to harm anything either.


A little potash (as in Potassium sulfate (K[SUB]2[/SUB]SO[SUB]4[/SUB]) or potassium magnesium sulfate (K[SUB]2[/SUB]SO[SUB]4[/SUB].2MgSO[SUB]4[/SUB])) will be fine.


Dolomite would make a nice cap.


Biollante

 

[Left C]

Hi Left C (aka Suitcase Jake),

Howdy

I have never used Amazonia original (or any other commercial substrate), but it is my impression that it is Leonardite, so I do not think there will be problem using more, it can be kind of messy, but it is good, so if you have it, I see no problem adding more.

I did not know that Amazonia is Leonardite. This is interesting.

I always like a layer of Sphagnum Peat Moss as the first layer; I also tend to mix it in as well.

Can do.

If you are using Osmocote Plus (my choice), I see no need to use Seachem Flourish Tabs (nothing wrong with them) or Wonder-Gro Root+ aquarium plant substrate tablets (I have no experience with this product).

I have a small container of Osmocote Plus.

I found some info about the Wonder-Gro Root+ tabs. They were made in Indonesia. A person called medicineman made them. I found some info that he said about them on another forum. He doesn't mention if the N is ammonical.

Hello.

Thank you for trying one of our products.

Our product consist of part that dissolves and part that do not dissolve.

On general the highlight is actually shown at the current label.
Only N-P-K is shown which is 10-8-10.

The rest are not shown in amount, which is an optional information and not an obligation to state by our local government as well as by US government as an import product for aquarium. This is well shown by how there are many prominent products (not only asian) that did not show content, more else the percentage (though we did managed to show the content by initiative). However they are proven to work well and loved by aquascaping crowd over the years.

It consist of artificial and natural parts as well as excipients (helping agents).

Artificial/chemical part:
- N 10%
- P 2%
- K 10%
- Fe 1%
- Mg
- Mn
- B
- Cu
- Zn
- Cl
- S
- Mo
- Complexing agent
- Binder

Natural part (minerals) :
- Zeolite mineral carrier 25%
- Phosphate (not readily active, non dissolving), Calcium (non dissolving) 35%
- Potasium
- Magnesium
- Iron
- Binder
- etc
Our various minerals contains a wide range of other elements in macro as well as micro scale. However it is guaranteed that they do not contain heavy metals hazardous chemicals in dangerous level.
We are trying our best in QC and screening the natural part in order to serve consistent quality to our customers.

I am not sure there is any great advantage to Ferrous sulfate, but a little mixed in isn’t going to harm anything either.

A little dusting then.

A little potash (as in Potassium sulfate (K[SUB]2[/SUB]SO[SUB]4[/SUB]) or potassium magnesium sulfate (K[SUB]2[/SUB]SO[SUB]4[/SUB].2MgSO[SUB]4[/SUB])) will be fine.

I have both K[SUB]2[/SUB]SO[SUB]4[/SUB] and K[SUB]2[/SUB]SO[SUB]4[/SUB]·2MgSO[SUB]4[/SUB]. Plus, I have some MgSO[SUB]4[/SUB]·7H[SUB]2[/SUB]O and some CaCl[SUB]2[/SUB]·2H[SUB]2[/SUB]O that I forgot to mention.

Dolomite would make a nice cap.


Biollante

My CaMg(CO[SUB]3[/SUB])[SUB]2[/SUB] is in the form of a gravel and it is off-white to beige in color. It would look bad as a topping over the blackish color of the Amazonia. I can't add this.

Thank you very much for your help here. I have never heard of anyone adding anything to Amazonia on startup. I'll try it. Tom mentioned adding some activated carbon to help improve the water discoloration from the Amazonia. I'll add it too.

 

[Left C]

I let it run all night and there were no leaks. I'm going to drain it, add the Amazonia and plant it.

I did not get a chance to plant it today. I just left it running with water in it.

My CO2 is plumbed into the adjustable flow Eheim needle wheel. I don't get a lot of mist or anything like that. I just see a few errant bubbles coming out. This is with the bubble rate running so fast that I can't count them. I am really impressed with it. There is no noise either. I have the pump running about 75% of wide open. Its rated flow range is from 211 to 713 gph. I'll turn down the bubble rate after it is planted.

I ran the CO2 again to check for mist. There is some. I could not see it last night. The room that the aquarium in doesn't have the best lighting. I could see the mist during the daylight today. It is present, but faint. I still like this Eheim 1103 pump.

 

[Biollante]

Coal Deposit


Hi Left C,

I am not sure about the Amazonia is Leonardite part, I have never used Amazonia, I have (do, as in currently) use Leonardite, they sound an awful lot alike.


The source of N being partly ammonium doesn’t concern us as much when it is in the substrate. Unless you just want too, I would go with the Osmocote Plus rather than the Wonder-Gro.


A layer of Dolomite or mixing it in won’t hurt and add a little Calcium long term (very long term).


I would keep the Calcium chloride for dosing, actually the same with the Epsom salts.


Biollante