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Last chance - Green Thread Algae

Discussion in 'Are you new to aquatic plants? Start here' started by dan_lup, Jun 9, 2012.

  1. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    GSA is also an indicator of more CO2.
    Sometimes PO4 is low, but poor CO2 and GSA are common.

    Plants still grow with poor CO2, they grow without any CO2 enrichment for that matter.
    So do not assume too much with thinking the CO2 is optimal, it RARELY is.

    So unless you have no algae, vibrant plant growth/health, healthy livestock, etc, do not assume the CO2 is optimal, it's very unlikely.
     
  2. dan_lup

    dan_lup Prolific Poster

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    i increased the CO2 from 1bps to 1.5 bps and i am sticking to the half dose schedule for the moment. the previous mentioned schedule for the 2 weeks is on hold, for the moment. will keep you updated. thank you.
     
  3. dan_lup

    dan_lup Prolific Poster

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    Good morning. I would like to present you an update after 4 weeks (Easy Life products):
    - 50% water change at every 2 weeks with Profito 10ml, Fosfo 10ml, Nitro 4ml and Kalium 10ml;
    - 1st week (daily): Profito 10ml, Fosfo 10 ml, Nitro 1 ml;
    - 2nd week (daily): Profito 10 ml, Fosfo 5 ml, Nitro 2ml.
    I made some water tests one hour ago and the results are: NO3 40ppm and PO4 2ppm. I never had such high values at these tests, but on the other hand, I never had such a clean and free of algae tank ;-)
    Well, I cheated a little bit with a help of a small SAE, which improved my daily fight against the algae. My Anubias Barteri was free of algae after 24 hours since the arrival of my little hero.

    What do you think about these high values of NO3 and PO4? Should I continue with this routine or should I try a daily dose of Profito 10ml, Fosfo 5 ml and NO3 1ml, which, theoretically, should lead to the results of NO3 ~ 26 and PO4~1.3?
    Thank you and looking forward to hear from you
     
  4. dutchy

    dutchy Plant Guru Team
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    The values you have are also quite normal for my tank. Nothing wrong with that. you could cut back on the NO3 a little bit, but If you lower PO4, you might get GSA.
    Adding less profito might cause deficiencies, I have heard some EI users that had to add double dose to prevent that.
     
  5. Forumsnow

    Forumsnow Member

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    Just wanted to say that I used Tetra AlgaeFix on my GSA at a half dose sprayed directly on the algae. It absolutely destroyed it in about 10 hours or less. I came home from work to find it all had turned gray and to mush. It was dead to the point where I could no longer pull it out with toothbrush/tweezers. I also increased co2 so I think I already had it on the outs.
     
  6. dan_lup

    dan_lup Prolific Poster

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    there are many ways to fight with chemicals against algae, but we are only solving the effect (the algae), if we use them. it is much more interesting to struggle to find the cause of this effect.
     
  7. Forumsnow

    Forumsnow Member

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    I understand what you are saying but I think I already know the cause, of course low co2. But I worked to improve my co2 to the point that new algae growth had ceased. The AlgeaFix was the nail in the coffin if you will.

    I do agree that chemicals should not be used as a band aid of sorts to kill the algae in the short term only to return because the root cause was not found. In my case I knew it was carbon as I dose ei. So I raised my light fixture by another 2" and increased co2. I think the chemicals helped push it over the edge and I believe helped kill anymore spores that may have been present. The fact that it only took a single half dose to totally nuke it only helps back up my belief I had it on the out.

    These are just my thoughts though and are not for everyone. Best of luck to your "fun" with algae.
     
  8. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    If you can remove all you can by hand, then clean and water changes..............clean filter perhaps etc, wipe glass good, toothbrush the rock/wood etc, spray Excel or what not on the wood/glass etc after that........
    Then go after the root cause also, generally poor CO2...........

    Then hit it with something like Algae fix..........that should make that product all that much better and effective, while not needing it again.
    Even after you stop the algae from growing, you still have the adult stages of the algae on plants, hiding in back corners etc.

    I generally am aginst algae killing chemicals.
    Excel is the one exception.

    I recently re evaluated Peroxide, H2O2..........I really cannot say it did much over the long term even with very aggressive daily attacks.

    I evaluated Algaefix, the trade off is you cannot use it with any invertebrates, like copper products. But unlike copper, it did not harm even mosses in a test tank.
    I generally toss the moss out if it gets infested with hair algae(Spirogyra) or Cladophora.

    So testing it was no big loss.
    Took a week basically and about 5 treatments.

    The label says 3 days, but I do not think so unless the algae issue is very mild.

    This was in a tank without gravel or other things, just a sponge filter, weak light that was turned on maybe 4-6 hours 2x over that week.
    I've never seen hair algae die in a week long blackout ever. So the light might have helped it along, but it was not the cause.

    I removed my shrimp from my 70 Gallon to test this on real planted tank and left the gold tetras in.
    Hair grass is pretty tough and I'll increase the light and test /dose for 1 week to see how well it does.

    Anything that does not harm plants or fish.......but kills several green algae, should be considered to kill what is left after a good cleaning, but it will not GROW the plants, which is why we have algae in the 1st place, we might not be caring for the tank, cleaning like we should etc.
    So this is just one aspect for re-infestations after you clean and fix things up.
     
  9. dan_lup

    dan_lup Prolific Poster

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    what is your opinion about Easy Carbo? i started to add 5ml daily as aditional CO2 for plants and prevention for algae spores
     
  10. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    It has zero impact on green algae species unless you spot dose which is a pain and you never get it all. That is the problem, green algae behave a lot like plants. BBA is easy comparatively. It is very suspectible to Excel/easy carbo. I have dosed aggressively with excel for weeks on end and it did nothing for hair algae, GSA, GDA, cladophora. Algae fix kicks its butt, but takes a few days. and it will kill any and all shrimp, which I like so I can cull the low grades and net out only the high grades from thickly planted tanks. That alone makes it a good product for me. It does cloud a typical planted tank. But this does not last long. The 1st day of treatment, the product does not appear to harm the shrimp much, but the 2-3rd treatments really do a number, they will be hurting for sure.

    I am on the 3rd day for the 70 gallon woodagumi with the hair grass. The hair algae is not growing, but it is not yet dying much. I increased the light to 50 percent and 8 hours, adjusted the CO2 just a little, and fish and plants seem fine. I also added a treatment to me non CO2 Ada 60p to see if it will kill all the snails and any little bit of diatoms in the corners etc.
     
  11. dan_lup

    dan_lup Prolific Poster

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    a very strange thing happened to my Hygrophila Polysperma: the edges of the upper leaves are twisted and the lower leaves have holes. until 2 months, when i had problems with the algaes and my fertilisation scheme was changing at every two weeks, this plant was the star of my tank. now, all the other plants look good and this plant is the cinderella. the high value of PO4 (2ppm) could affect this plant?
     
  12. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    No, when a weed starts to act funny, it can often die back and wait and it will start regrowing aggressively later.
    The fragments hopefully land somewhere better and the weed spreads via autofragmentation. Myriophyllums do this also.

    (high) PO4 does not matter to any plant, I've had high PO4 in growing media for years, decades now. Never seen any issues.

    I tried the Algaefix on the 70 Gal tank, it's pretty much toasted after end of the 3'rd day and the 4th I can say it's gone. There's some detritus etc.........but some light vacuuming etc is all that is needed.
    Plants look great now, I added 2x more light and increased the photoperiod back to 8 hours. umol is at 80-90 light PAR.
    The CO2 was readjusted which should take care of it at 45-55 ppm.
     
  13. fplata

    fplata Member

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    Tom, Is the algae fix product you are referring to, is it the one made by API?
     
  14. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Yes, not their algae destroyer etc. It does not have copper in it.

    I've not heard any negative issues with it to date, as like" it did not work", "It harmed my plants..." etc.
     
  15. dan_lup

    dan_lup Prolific Poster

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    Happy New Year, guys! i wish you clear waters, healthy plants and fish.

    just want to share with you some photos, and of course a small new problem. first, the photos:

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    and now the small problem: a have 2 new algaes: spirongyra and cladophora. the are lets say nice algae, with no impacht in the growth of the plants, but i struggle to find the cause. i installed a small water pump to improve the water circulation. could be a CO2 issue? 6.5 is the ph with a magnetic valve which starts the CO2 with one hour before the lights are on and shuts it off with one hour before the lights are off.

    any ideas how to deal with this situation?
     
  16. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    spirongyra and cladophora. - Cladophora does not seem effected by algaefix. Not unless you really spot treat with it while doing a water change etc.
    Spirogyra will die pretty easily though with algaefix.

    Mostly CO2 seems to be the causes, particularly with higher light.
    GDA will grow even with moderately low light, say 30 umols.

    The tank appears clean in the picture. Traces= you could add more. Light seems a little on the lower side.

    You might adjust the CO2 up a small amount, then watch for a week. Then if things are fine, no difference, add a tiny bit more CO2.
    The effect on plants should be noticeable, but more subtle. Same for algae, but then later, after 2-3 weeks, the algae will not grow.

    It is important to focus on new growth for algae, and for plants.
     
  17. dan_lup

    dan_lup Prolific Poster

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    hello, again. i lost the battle with cladophora and spirogyra. i did not want to put any chemicals, but i had no choice. i used H2O2 and the tank looks better now. i put 10 ml in the 1st day, 20 ml in the 2nd day and 40 ml in the 3rd day (126l tank). i changed the water after one week. i thought that i wiped out my shrimp population, but after the water change they started to move again in the tank. i know that i should have changed the water after 3-4 hours after the full treatment (1ml per each liter of water). i decreased the Profito and Fosfo daily additions, due to the fact that these algaes are present in tanks which are rich of nutrients.

    will keep you updated about this experiment
     
    #57 dan_lup, May 2, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: May 16, 2013
  18. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Best keep up on the water changes, trimming and harass the algae, more shrimp will help.

    If you keep up on everything, these 2 algae will go away, but it takes elbow grease/hard work over about 1-2 months.
     
  19. PatFox

    PatFox Junior Poster

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    better to clean it of every week once to avoid such awkward things and dirt here
     
  20. Maxwell

    Maxwell Junior Poster

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    Phew...awesome pics buddy..the tank looks really awesome. The close up shots are quite good and yeah about the problem..yes their is definitely a CO2 issue. The presence of oxygen is extremely necessary so make sure that there is plenty of it. Cleaning once in a while will is extremely essential.
     
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