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kanamycin

Discussion in 'Algae Control' started by yme, Aug 2, 2006.

  1. yme

    yme Lifetime Charter Member
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    hi tom,

    After doing multiple rounds of blackouts, the BGA starts still coming back. Incubation of plants for 5 days in a bucket in the basement (more than 100% dark) didn´t get rid of it.

    So I am quite desperate. I would like to go for e-mycin, but since I have no credit card, it seems that I cannot buy it.

    However, diana walstad mentioned that one can get rid of BGA by kanamycin. And that antibiotic is abundant at the lab where I work.

    So can I get rid of the BGA by adding kanamycin? If so, at what dose should the antibiotic be administered? And will it harm the shrimps and potamogeton species?

    thanks!

    yme
     
  2. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: kanamycin

    I suppose it should be fine for everything.
    BGA is a wimpy "bacteria" when it comes to Antibiotics.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  3. yme

    yme Lifetime Charter Member
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    Re: kanamycin

    ah, thanks!

    I will try it.
    but you don´t have by any change a dosing advice? mg/l and one or multiple doses?

    greets,

    yme
     
  4. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: kanamycin

    I'd stick with 1/2 the suggested dosing per liter etc on the label.
    This is a slightly newer antibiotic than EM.

    If you look at the structure 3 dimensionally, there is an inherent beauty to EM and many of these other antibiotics.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  5. yme

    yme Lifetime Charter Member
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    Re: kanamycin

    well...
    we use kanamycin at a concentration of 50 mg/l to grow kanamycin resistant bacteria. it seems like this is a bit high for the intended purpose :D

    for e-mycin I found that most people do a 3-5 times dose with a pause between each dose of 24 hours and at a concentration of 2.5 mg/l. I think I´ll use this regime?

    greets,

    yme
     
  6. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: kanamycin

    That seems fine to me.
    Antibiotic resistence is not likely to occur with BGA(but would if you did enough), they are so different from other bacteria, I'd give them a different classification than they have presently.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  7. yme

    yme Lifetime Charter Member
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    Re: kanamycin

    oke! I´ll try it. (after my vacation that is, I´m leaving without a couple of hours :D )

    Currently the BGA is classified in kingdom III, together with prochlorophytes. Why do you think this is not correct? very interesting! maybe a barrreport worthy?

    greets,

    yme
     
  8. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: kanamycin

    Well, the BGA's are radically different anything in the Bacteria and also within eukaryotic oganisms.

    While many bacterologist have "stolen them" from the phycologist, most of the work done has been primarily by phycologist and they have a role more like the algae than bacteria in most cases.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  9. yme

    yme Lifetime Charter Member
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    Re: kanamycin

    well, the kanamycin worked..... for a week :mad:
    now it is present again! I don't know why! is my PO4 too high? the photospectrometer says 1.5 mg/l. the NO3 level is according to the photospectrometer 40 mg/l and according to the seachem test 20 mg/l. I don't think it is but....

    taken together, things are not going very bad. Only two things apart from the BGA I don't like:
    -Some, but not all, tops of the stargrass have really white (not light green, but really white) new leaves and then tend to dissolve. I must say that this plant is a bit in the shadow of the nymphaea glandulifera. can that be the problem?
    -The tops of the proserpinaca palustris cuba are tiny and red.

    The last couple of months I introduced quite some changes, which were aimed for getting the tonina to grow. It seems that I have accomplished that! No more melting and a fair growth rate.

    -Increased the CO2 availability. I setup a second powerhead and connected the CO2 line, with an airstone, to the inlet. One is located on the left back corner, the other on the right back corner. The flow is more or less aimed at a 45-degree angle to the front glass to get many bubbles to the tonina. It works; the bubbles get almost everywhere, although less on the left and right front corners.

    -decreased the light. I now have only 3 30 watt TLs for nine hours. Since the tonina don´t mind, I think this is enough. And like you stated, it is easier to get the system stable and less pruning!

    I lowered the nutrients since there is less light. 0.3 mg/l PO4 per day and 1 mg/l after a waterchange (target is 1.5 mg/l). 3 mg/l NO3 per day and 10 mg/l after a waterchange. (and still BGA… L )
    After a waterchange, I add MgCl2 to get 2 mg/l and CaCl2 to get 20 mg/l. And I add 2.5 ml flourish and 2.5 ml flourish iron per day. pH is 5.95-6.0 and KH 1.25-1.5 according to the watercompany. The temperature is lately a bit low, 22.5 at night and 23.5 in the evening.

    You learned me that the red colour of the proserpinaca could be due to low NO3. Altough not likely, I added more NO3. Now I see increased growth of single stranded fuzz algae on the glass and leaves. The proserpinaca is still red and has small new leaves. This plant is also in the direct flow of the right powerhead, so since the tonina doesn´t melt and the proserpinaca gets more bubbles I cannot imagine that CO2 is the problem.

    So together:
    -why I am I keeping the BGA? There’s no rotting wood, I clean the filter every month, do a 50% water change every week, vacuum the bottom and there are only a few barbus pentazona in the tank, so the bioload isn´t very hight….
    -what can I do to improve the health of the stargrass and the proserpinaca?

    and of course some pics. (it seems that I cannot find the gallery, so the pics are from a dutch forum: vvv)

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Thanks again!

    yme
     
  10. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: kanamycin

    I really like what you have going here.
    Tanks wise and scaping.

    A couple of minor things will greatly enhance the tank:
    Slope the gravel front to back.
    Most good Dutch styling has this.

    See plants, not gravel line.
    Add some hill sides on opposite sides of the display, make a border terraces with some nice grained wood.

    The groups are nice, just need to add some to it.

    Eythromyacin should work for longer time frames(month or more if you corrected the issue).

    Blackout typically does about a week as well.
    It works with good KNO3 dosing/CO2.

    3 days, done.
    Tonia fluviatas might not like it though.


    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  11. yme

    yme Lifetime Charter Member
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    Re: kanamycin

    thanks for the advice! coming from the compliments about the scaping of the tank is a real compliment!

    yeh, I know about the gravel line. The problem is that the you can already see the gravel when it is 1 cm high. This amount of gravel cannot hold the blyxa attached. So in order to not see the gravel, I have to tape the front glass or something like it.

    About the wood. It should be placed at 1/3 of the tank?
    And what do you mean by grained wood? the good old dutch "kienhout" or mangrove roots, which are pretty massive or the more fine "fingerlike" structured wood that amano is using? I think the good old "kienhout"? If so, How large should the pieces be? the tank is 100x40x40. Should it be a focal point or just a silent not really visible border? Should both pieces be equal in size or is one big piece and one small piece better?

    I have some old pieces still lying around. They are rotting etc. but maybe i'll put them in, take a picture and let you get an impression about the wood. Saves me a lot of money if you can tell me is this kind of wood gives the right result or not.

    thanks!

    yme
     
  12. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: kanamycin

    I use thin flat pieces for terracing. Nice bends that are thin are always covetted.

    The line of terracing should be snake like though the tank, at least I feel it should. Anywhere from 1/3 to the fromnt or 1/3 to the rear, sometimes 1/2 is fine, depends really.

    Angled from the rear corner forwards to the alomost the front edge works well etc also.

    Up to you really, play around and see what you think will give a nice display, place a cut out of the tank below and place the wood around to see.

    No branchy pieces needed here.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  13. yme

    yme Lifetime Charter Member
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    Re: kanamycin

    I will try and play :)

    but first get more plants!!!

    greets,

    yme
     

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