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I want to understand

Discussion in 'Aquatic Plant Fertilization' started by Briceboke, Dec 1, 2017.

  1. Briceboke

    Briceboke New Member

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    Hi everyone.

    From a website I should add 0.88 ppm of Fe in 3 times during a week.

    My aquarium is 86L .

    Does it means that I should add each time:
    0.88/3 * 86= 25 mg/L ?
     
  2. Briceboke

    Briceboke New Member

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    I did the same for the macros,

    I have a product for macro containing 10ml=
    N= 110 mg
    P= 10 mg
    K = 160 mg

    From the rotala buterfly website I should reach N = 8 ppm
    K = 5 ppm

    My tank is 86 L
    Does this mean that I should calculate as followed?

    10 ml = 110 mg N so for 86 L it would be
    10 ml = 110/86 = 1.27 ppm so
    8 ppm/ 1.27 ppm = 6.29

    I therefor should add 60 ml of the solution?

    For the K I reach with same calculation 30 ml of solution.

    So if I add let say 40 ml of solutiin I am good?

    And this 3 times a week?

    It seems big no?
     
  3. VaughnH

    VaughnH Lifetime Charter Member
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    "ppm" means parts per million. One ppm would be one microgram per gram. So if you have 86 x 1000 = 86000 grams of water, 0.88 ppm is 0.88 x 86000/1000000 = .076 grams - 76 milligrams.
     
  4. Briceboke

    Briceboke New Member

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    So if my solution has 12 mg per 10 ml it means I need to add 76/12= 6.3
    So I should add 60 ml?
     
  5. VaughnH

    VaughnH Lifetime Charter Member
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    My brain isn't shifting from low gear this evening, so someone else needs to figure this out.:(
     
  6. Kyalgae

    Kyalgae Lifetime Members
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    ppm = mg/L or mg/kg right?

    So you want to reach 5 ppm K = 5mg/L

    5mg/L*86L = 430mg you need to add

    (430mg/160mg)*10mL so add 26.9mL to reach 5ppm K so let’s say 27mL for 5ppm and 54mL for 10ppm K

    Did I fool myself, or is this correct?
     
  7. Briceboke

    Briceboke New Member

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    So this is how I thought.

    Thank you.
     
  8. Allwissend

    Allwissend Article Editor
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    ppm=1:10E+6=1:1000000 - a ratio
    mg/L , mg/kg - derived units for concentration
    So ppm is not a unit of concentration, it is just a ratio. I can just as well say 10ppm elephants to chickens. It was used in old scientific articles wrongly to denote concentration and picked up by the hobby where it remained so, with the general meaning of mg/L. 1 ppm (mass/mass) = 1mg/kg and may or may not be equal to 1mg/L , depending on the liquid used, temperature, pressure etc.

    That being said, I think we need a little clarification before answering the @Briceboke question.

    Adding 0.88 mg/L *3 = 2.64 mg/L --- this is the total concentration of Fe that will be added to your aquarium. It is not the volume you add.




    Can you check what it says on the bottle
    10mL of solution contain 110mg N
    OR
    10mL of solution add 110mg/L in X volume of water
     
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  9. Briceboke

    Briceboke New Member

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    Hi,

    So as a start I am trying to find a website telling me how much I should add of macro and micro to my tank.
    My products are not part of the database of rotalabutterfly...

    My bottle say 10ml contains N=110mg , etc.
    For the micro it says as per the picture below.

    20171201_155036.jpg
     
  10. Allwissend

    Allwissend Article Editor
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    Ok, looks good. Just wanted to be sure that it is not mg/L (ppm) as most manufacturers report. But, I guess this has to be different ..( and extremely diluted):confused: heh.

    Then I agree with the calculations. But here is the math starting from the other end, knowing what concentration you want :

    8mg/L* 86L = 688mg - mass of N needed to get the desired conc.
    688mg / 110mg (per 10mL) = 6,25 - number of doses
    6,25*10mL =62,5mL - volume to be added for N

    But I would suggest starting with at most of 2 mg/L N and 0.4 mg/L P, 3 times a week.
    2*86/110*10=15mL for N
    0.4*86/10*10=34mL for P
    ...
    You can use tom's articles for EI , or rotala's target levels for EI and figure from there how much of this solution you need to use
     
    #10 Allwissend, Dec 2, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2017
  11. Phishless

    Phishless Lifetime Member
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    Since Tropica Aquaflorin Potassium is a micro nutrient solution I would establish a dose based on Fe.
    If 10ml contains 12mg of Fe, 12mg of an average Fe chelate 10% would deliver .0139ppm of Fe in 86l of water.
    But we don't know what the actual Fe ingredient is???
    What 3x a week EI dose do you wish to target?

    Just to reach .1 Fe 3x per week would be a 70ml dose, totaling 210ml per week.
    500ml bottle last 2 weeks @ average $20US, over $500 per year in micros.

    This sounds like a very expensive fert option if I am reading this all correctly.
     
  12. Allwissend

    Allwissend Article Editor
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    0.1 mg/L Fe *86 = 8.6mg
    8.6/ 12= 0.7166
    I would say that is the actual Fe amount, not the Fe+chelator amount. This would be the most devoid of assumptions approach. So
    0.1 mg/L Fe *86 = 8.6mg
    8.6mg/12mg= 0.7166
    0.7166*10mL~=7mL per dose

    You can of course test in pure distilled water what the dose gives you in terms of the Fe conc.
     
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  13. Briceboke

    Briceboke New Member

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    Hi thank you I need to seat and read your answers several time ,.

    The product is tropical brand(not tropica)
    I am in Lebanon beirut(middle east ) it is very hard to find branded products.

    I will try to set a schedule and send it to you to see if you agree.

    Thankbyou again.
     
  14. Phishless

    Phishless Lifetime Member
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    If 10ml in fact = 12ppm or mg/l concentration, / 86l = .139ppm of Fe for about a 1/3 EI dose on micros.
    Based on actual Fe amount and not weight of dry compound.
     
  15. Briceboke

    Briceboke New Member

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    hi I am reading the article about EI from Mr. Barr and he says for typical set up aquarium 20G
    you need - Fluorite (any porous iron rich material will do) about 7-10cm depth - I do not know what this means. any input?
     
  16. Allwissend

    Allwissend Article Editor
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    Hi. I don't think any of us can speak for Tom Barr. In my opinion Flourite or any particular substrate is not required. Some plants will do better if a nutrient source in the substrate is present to act as a backup but not required. And subjectively, I think most plants like to be anchored( except floating plants) - this gives them a stable point to grow to --- up stays up.

    Sand, soil, ADA, Tropica, Fluval, Eco(in)complete... all work. Just have different base proprieties.
     
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