How to go more low tech without encorraging algae

Linds

Junior Poster
Jan 30, 2013
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North East Victoria, Australia
Hello all,

I have a tank set up at my parents house (where I live atm) and I am moving very soon. It is roughly and 80L tank but only has about 60L of water with the substrate and rocks. It is inert substrate, I have added some Osmocote under some of the plants. It seems to be going alright, but I have no experience to compare with. I am dosing EI using liquid mixed from dry chems.

It has a single t8 over it so falls in the low light category well and truley. I have had the photoperiod at 6h for the first month and a bit, I have given it another hour now. I'd like to increase it further because I lie to actually see my tank but I'm afraid of algae.

I have pressurised CO2 running through a DIY inline diffuser.

My crypts are growing really well, they didn't die back at all when I planted them ( I think I lost one leaf) and since they have been growing a lot of new leaves.



This pic is when I first planted (minus the moss which was still in the bag).

You could say I'm having algae problems but I'm also not. Sounds confusing but bear with me. When I first planted the tank I had a few Anubias. They had some spot algae and some other green hair algae. Since they have been in my new setup the algae has died and now it just looks brown on the old leaves, the new ones are nice and algae free. However up the top I'ts another story.

Here are two recent pics.




As you can see I'm getting this ugly algae. It's all up the top where the light is more intense.

So what I want to know is what I can do. Do I need more CO2? the ferts seem to be high enough because I'm using the same for a higher light tank and it is not growing algae. Or is it maybe a flow thing? It is nowhere near 10 time turnover. The one thing against the flow theory is that the filter outlet flows directly over where the first pic is showing.

Added to this I am about to move. So this means my mum will have to look after it for a while until I get a place in Melbourne. Id there a reason I can't does all my ferts for the week after I do my water change each week? I think that would be doable for my mum.

Any thoughts?

Lindsay
 

Dennis Singh

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May 5, 2013
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Id like to take a stab at this one

Question first does ei really gow with low light low tech? Ive found that low light if ur using tap has enough fertz in it. In looking at substrate doesnt seem low light at wat the light seems to be penetrating, is 10000k bulb?, also the subs might be leaching silicates into the water. Not sure what inert means. I know u do weekly water change but how much?
What u can try to do is reduce photoperiod, up water changes, dose glut maybe, manual removal.
 

Linds

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Jan 30, 2013
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North East Victoria, Australia
strungout;114374 said:
Id like to take a stab at this one

Go for your life. I'll take your opinion and do the same with it as anyone else's. If what you say makes sense I'm apt to go with it.

Question first does ei really gow with low light low tech?

Well atm it's not really low tech, just low light. I just want to convert to low tech or something my mother can easily maintain while I'm not here. I'm happy to have little to no growth. I just don't want Algae to thrive.

Ive found that low light if ur using tap has enough fertz in it.

Maybe you are right, I have never tested my water for nutrients. I don't own a test kit for that.

In looking at substrate doesnt seem low light at wat the light seems to be penetrating, is 10000k bulb?,

It is 18000.

The photo possibly looks brighter than it is. I'm just going on what I have been told and what I can find out. I have never found any info to suggest it isn't well and truly in the low light category.

also the subs might be leaching silicates into the water. Not sure what inert means. I know u do weekly water change but how much?

Possible, it is silaca based gravel, well... it has granite and other quartz in it. Inert mean it doesn't react (with the other things associated). I have very few diatom problems, I have only had to clean my glass once since planting and even then it wasn't bad, just not clean. For that reason I had ruled out silicates. But I don't know for sure.

I do a 50% water change weekly.

What u can try to do is reduce photoperiod, up water changes, dose glut maybe, manual removal.

To less than 6h? I really don't want to do that. I may as well not have a tank if I can only admire it for 6h or less a day. There has to be another solution.

Why do you say up the water changes?

Why would I use Glut? Also I have a vallis in there. I hear it kills it. I'm not super worried though. Id rather have an algae free aquarium.

I can remove it manually, but I also want to solve the problem not just remove the algae and let it grow back.

Thanks

Lindsay
 

Dennis Singh

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May 5, 2013
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With upping your photoperiod try upping your co2 but if your gassing your fish then well you know lower n such, keep adjusting like said co2 takes a lot of fine tuning n practice. No glut, my bad. Wcs can do some wonderful things I cannot explain. Would ur mom be fine with biweekly ones? If ur going route of more photoperiod and ei I suggest raising co2 n getting in right range. U could as well add more plants and more and more, I see a lot of slowgrowers like anubias which wont uptake the nutrients as fast
 

Linds

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Jan 30, 2013
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strungout;114414 said:
With upping your photoperiod try upping your co2 but if your gassing your fish then well you know lower n such, keep adjusting like said co2 takes a lot of fine tuning n practice.

I'll try. Maybe I need a more efficient diffuser.

No glut, my bad.

I was just asking. why did you change your mind?

Wcs can do some wonderful things I cannot explain. Would ur mom be fine with biweekly ones?

I'm the kind of guy who doesn't do things unless I know why I'm doing them.

Mum could probably do a weekly one. But I'm already doing that.

If ur going route of more photoperiod and ei I suggest raising co2 n getting in right range. U could as well add more plants and more and more, I see a lot of slowgrowers like anubias which wont uptake the nutrients as fast

I don't really want to increase the photoperiod, I just don't want to go less than 6h.

I would love to add more plants. But two problems are 1) there are no places to buy plants close and I'm only here a week more so mail order is out. 2) what would I grow? the crypts are really the only plants growing at any rate, the rest are really just growing slowly or surviving. I asked about plants for this tank when I planted it an got a very short list. I have planted more plants that were cheap or free too just to see if any of them grow. A couple are surviving but I wouldn't say they are growing as fast as they would in their ideal conditions.

I got some blyxa Japonica because it was supposed to be good for low light, but nearly all of it has died or isn't growing. I think it's because I only have gravel substrate. Maybe it's the same with some of the others.

I'm open to suggestion. I have looked at ceratophyllum online, I'd love some because apparently it grows in low light. But I don't know where to get it. What should I pull out to plant it?

Linds
 

Dennis Singh

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May 5, 2013
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Changed my mind on glut because it will melt your vals like you stated, ill let more experienced members answer your qs but there are so many low light plants out there you can work with, soooo many. Ur limited if you cant get mail though.
 

Linds

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Jan 30, 2013
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strungout;114500 said:
Changed my mind on glut because it will melt your vals like you stated, ill let more experienced members answer your qs but there are so many low light plants out there you can work with, soooo many. Ur limited if you cant get mail though.

There may be so many low light plants but the problem is getting them and also having a substrate they like too. Seems many of them prefer soil, and I can see why.

I can get mail. I just only have a few days left here before I move. I was going to order some shrimp, but they would not get here in time either. The main problem is there aren't many proper plant places. I go to a LFS and see so many terrestrial plants drowning it's saddening.

I have got mum to try a 50% wc and fertiliser dose once a week, I hope this will be ok. Soon find out. I also upped my CO2 today, nearly double what I was, fish are all fine so far (but I also did a wc today). Hopefully the increased CO2 will be all it needs.

Thanks for the advice so far, I do appreciate it. I'd be happy for anyone to step in, but no takers so far. :)

Linds
 

unheatedtank

Junior Poster
May 28, 2013
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I am not experienced either, but I do have algae, small amounts of all types due to my outdoor setting in a 6x2x2 with 2hours direct sun light to half of the tank... So I have hair algae, green spot in that part, and diatom and string algae in the other half..

Then, I try to answer what I am currently trying after hours if reading every nights.
In my case, I am increasing CO2 and add more NO3 as I have too less fish as no time to stock with that unheated outdoor tank.

I can see that you did so and already know your dosing scheme, my suggestion is what I think you my need:
1. A cleaning crew such as glass shrimp and bistlenose...
2. Some frogbit to take excessive ferts and blocking some lights as your plant are low light
3. Some horntail or foxtail also will help but it may not be nice. You can try to get a bunch of wisteria cutting and plant them in the back, your gravel is ok as they can take fert fom water columns. Put a few dino dung deep down your gravel near them to encourage their roots should be fine.

Hope this help, and pls note that fighting algae will tke time...
 

Linds

Junior Poster
Jan 30, 2013
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North East Victoria, Australia
unheatedtank;114528 said:
I can see that you did so and already know your dosing scheme, my suggestion is what I think you my need:
1. A cleaning crew such as glass shrimp and bistlenose...

I'm keen on getting some shrimp, so I will do a mail order when I go away and get mum to put them in.


3. Some horntail or foxtail also will help but it may not be nice. You can try to get a bunch of wisteria cutting and plant them in the back, your gravel is ok as they can take fert fom water columns. Put a few dino dung deep down your gravel near them to encourage their roots should be fine.

I have fertliser in my gravel under a lot of the plants. More plants aren't going to happen at this time I'm afraid. I might be able to put some in soonish, but I need to find the right ones.

Thanks

Linds
 

unheatedtank

Junior Poster
May 28, 2013
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If you have gravel with big size, your root tabs may leak back to water and causing algae. So, you need to consider that with your fert dosing or get a test kit to check Nitrate and Phosphate.
 

Linds

Junior Poster
Jan 30, 2013
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North East Victoria, Australia
unheatedtank;114586 said:
If you have gravel with big size, your root tabs may leak back to water and causing algae. So, you need to consider that with your fert dosing or get a test kit to check Nitrate and Phosphate.

The gravel is large. It is a controlled release fertiliser though. So I don't know.


What I find hard to understand is why so many people tell me that algae is caused by excess nutrient when I look at stunning tanks that have a huge excess of nutrients. I see all these articles on EI (which on principle supplies excess nutrient) and people who swear by it. I see cattle troughs at home with no added nutrient growing so much algae I can scoop out multiple hand fulls a day in the summer.

Excess nutrient theoretically and experientially (other people's) doesn't cause algae. I have never seen a solution to algae on a thread that worked involving reducing nutrient dosing. What am I missing?

Linds
 

Tom Barr

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Jan 23, 2005
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Linds, people are not focusing on plant growth, that indirectly, leads to something else growing in there: algae.

Our goal is about growing nice lush aquatic plants.

I was running in the mountains above Napa, CA and ran by a nice horse trough filled with water and a slow drip. While I did not drink, I did cool myself off after 9 miles of trail dust and sweat.
In this trough, there was a little green hair algae, not very much though compared to many troughs, but there was a fair amount of pondweed growing on the bottom. The water was nice and clear, looked good enough to drink perhaps.
It was out in the full sun. Even on a dry dusty mountain side full of lava and oaks, there were aquatic plants.

A good myth is hard to kill.
 

Linds

Junior Poster
Jan 30, 2013
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North East Victoria, Australia
Tom Barr;114624 said:
Linds, people are not focusing on plant growth, that indirectly, leads to something else growing in there: algae.

Our goal is about growing nice lush aquatic plants.

Yes, I agree. What I want to know is how I achieve this with what I have or what I can change.

I was running in the mountains above Napa, CA and ran by a nice horse trough filled with water and a slow drip. While I did not drink, I did cool myself off after 9 miles of trail dust and sweat.
In this trough, there was a little green hair algae, not very much though compared to many troughs, but there was a fair amount of pondweed growing on the bottom. The water was nice and clear, looked good enough to drink perhaps.
It was out in the full sun. Even on a dry dusty mountain side full of lava and oaks, there were aquatic plants.

A good myth is hard to kill.

Are you saying that there wasn't a lot of algae because the plants were growing?

Linds