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holes in my Tiger lotus when they reach the water line

Discussion in 'General Plant Topics' started by ir0n_ma1den, Aug 16, 2009.

  1. ir0n_ma1den

    ir0n_ma1den Prolific Poster

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    My tiger lotus has been doing great as it has many large leaves, and as of right now has two developing stems.

    The problem is that it seems once the leaves near the top, they develop holes and i guess rot away.

    I'm trying to get the thing to flower but to no avail.

    It's in a 29g tank with a 65w light soon to be 2x65w, dosing pressurized CO2 and a dry ferts regime.

    thanks
     
  2. Tug

    Tug Lifetime Charter Member
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    :) This often happens on older leaves along with some yellowing if levels of K+ and Mg are low. For flowers, it might help if phosphate levels are between 2 and 5 ppm.
     
  3. Biollante

    Biollante Lifetime Charter Member
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    I am with Tug.

    I associate the withering leaves before reaching the surface with a lack of Potassium, as a practical matter I increase the dosing generally. Also my experience with flowering is high demand for Phosphates 4 or 5 ppm works for me in a tank with just over 3 watts per gallon of 6700 K lighting.

    This is assuming things are otherwise correct, things like the growing tip uncovered, water conditions generally good, general good practices.

    I will also say this is just my experience; these things grow well when we meet their needs.

    You have good light now and are going to high lighting and even more so it those 2-65-watt bulbs are t-5’s with wonderful reflectors, it is then very high lighting indeed. Just remember to increase the dosing including a higher demand for CO2.

    Biollante
     
  4. ir0n_ma1den

    ir0n_ma1den Prolific Poster

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    Thank you guys very much!

    My new lighting system arrives Wednesday from Catalina Aquariums.

    They are not T-5s, but just 2x 65w compact florescents.


    Here is my current dosing alternating every other day macro/micro:

    Day A

    Potassium Nitrate - 3 dashes (3/8 tsp)
    Mono Potassium Phosphate - 1 nip (1/64 tsp)

    Day B

    Plantex CSM+B - 1 Smidgen (1/32 tsp)




    How should I increase my dosing in order to balance the new lighting?
     
  5. Biollante

    Biollante Lifetime Charter Member
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    Nice Lights!

    Hi,

    Those are nice lights and still a lot of light.:)

    I recommend dosing the following three times a week:
    • Potassium Nitrate KNO3 at 3/8 teaspoon
    • Monopotassium phosphate KH2PO4 at 1/16 teaspoon
    • Potassium Sulfate K2SO4 3/16 teaspoon
    • Epsom Salt MgSO4 1 teaspoon
    Alternate day:
    • CSM+B 3/16 maybe even ¼ teaspoon

    With all that light you may need to adjust these upward, but it should be a good start point.;)

    Biollante
     
  6. ir0n_ma1den

    ir0n_ma1den Prolific Poster

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    I've been doing this for about 2 years, same tank, and I have never got such good information, thanks!

    I can get Epsom Salt at the grocery store right?

    What are the benefits of using Potassium Sulfate?
     
  7. Tug

    Tug Lifetime Charter Member
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    CSM+B will not add PO4, but your water system probably has it anyway. See if your plants flower. :D
    The K+ helps with nutrient uptake.
     
    #7 Tug, Aug 17, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 30, 2010
  8. Biollante

    Biollante Lifetime Charter Member
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    Kinda What Tug Said

    Kinda what Tug said!

    I think a little more than is generally available in most water supply systems. In addition, something I have been seeing referenced and seeing evidence of is that while some minerals may be present, they may be “spent” or ionically (not sure it is a word) unavailable, perhaps due to processing. (I know I am going to get a beating for this one.):(

    Something called Liebig's Law of the Minimum seems to apply with Magnesium.

    A good read or two:
    A Novel Family of Magnesium Transport Genes in Arabidopsis -- Li et al. 13 (12): 2761 -- THE PLANT CELL
    Plant nutrition manual - Google Books
    http://turf.lib.msu.edu/1970s/1972/721101.pdf

    What I know is that the stuff really pops up growth and in particular flowering.:cool:

    If you are a little gutzy and have a sense of humor, a couple of milliliters of Fleet Enemas:eek: with the macros will perk up that Tiger Lotus of yours.

    Biollante
     
  9. Tug

    Tug Lifetime Charter Member
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    Thank you Biollante,

    Let me see if I have this is right. With only this to add; good water flow prevents dead spots and prevents nutrients/CO2/wast from settling in one spot. Plant growth is dependent on a number of different factors, such as sunlight, mineral nutrients and CO2. The availability of these may vary, such that at any given time one is more limiting than the others. Growth is controlled not by the total of resources available, but by the scarcest resource (limiting factor). EI was developed with this in mind to reduce limiting factors. With plenty of light, your nutrients and CO2 are the limiting factors addressed by the EI method. You can try to guess what's limiting your plant growth and causing yellowing leaves (low K+ levels; Mg, Fe, CO2, ect.,) or reduce the amount of light. A modified EI non CO2 method could also be an option.

    If you can, get creative with your lighting, (low light part of the time with one light and two lights for a midday peak.) If not, then CSM+B or Seachem flourish equivalents (flourish comprehensive and/or equilibrium) to provide mineral trace, add CO2 enrichment, extra PO4. It depends on what you want to do.
     
    #9 Tug, Aug 19, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 30, 2010
  10. Biollante

    Biollante Lifetime Charter Member
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    Yep.

    Yep, it is based on or rather “called” Liebig's Law of the Minimum. Justus von Liebig, used the imagery of a barrel to illustrate the concept, we now call that barrel Liebig’s barrel. This is a quick explanation Law of the Minimum - Liebig's Law with a cute illustration.:)

    Actually, we don’t, shouldn’t guess, we estimate, based on the science as we understand it and experience. You people (you know who you are, beady bright-adapted-eyes, brains, opposable thumbs) tend to over-complicate, over-think the whole process.;)

    In general, we say that light drives the process, and then we have to balance the needs of the plants with those of our critters. :rolleyes:

    To complicate the matter even if we don’t have “critters” we still can’t just dump in unlimited amounts of nutrients as at various points everything becomes toxic.

    Biollante
     
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