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"High quality" External Needle Wheel Pumps: Danner, Eheim, or ??

Discussion in 'General Plant Topics' started by growitnow, Feb 17, 2011.

  1. growitnow

    growitnow Lifetime Charter Member
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    Hello,

    I want to switch from my AM1000 reactor to an external needle wheel pump. The idea of an external needle wheel pump is attractive (to me) because you can hook the pump output to loc-line Ys etc. that distribute CO2. I see this as one advantage of an external needle wheel pump - it seems to offer more options of co2 distribution.

    But - I have gotten the impression that external needle wheel pumps have crappy flow, especially at any head. For example (from my estimations), the Eheim needle wheel pump touts:

    712 gph at zero head, which drops to sucko levels of
    396 gph at 3.3ft head
    316 gph at 4.1ft head

    If, as in my case, I really do want a NW pump that can drive water through a few 90 degree elbows, up 4ft of head, and then through another split to one left and one right loc-line Ys that dump co2 enriched water into my 90gal tank -- 300-400gph ain't going to do it. Right now, my [HASHTAG]#1260[/HASHTAG] Eheim hobby pump (635gph) that drives the reactor provides "OK" flow out of the loc-line heads.

    QUESTION:
    What are the options?
    I seek an external NW pump with good flow, moderately quiet, and strong reputation for quality (NO,repeat, NO LEAKS).

    There is progressive interest in NW for co2 delivery. But I don't see (as much) corresponding discussion of external NW pumps. Am I missing something or are there just not that many decent options yet?

    I'd welcome any input. When I found out Eheim had an external NW pump I thought that would be great. Then discovering the low flow and reading other comments that some of the other available external NW pumps are of "low" quality was a bummer.

    thanks,
    growitnow


    good external pump needle wheel thread - compares Danner and others
    http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/75891-needle-wheel-co2-diffusion-fractionating-impeller.html

    External Eheim needle wheel pump not strong enough:
    http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/101142-eheim-needle-wheel-pump-problems-updated.html

    External Eheim needle wheel pump:
    http://premiumaquatics.com/aquatic-supplies/EH-1103220.html

    External Danner needle wheel pump:
    http://www.marinedepot.com/Danner_Model_Supreme_Pumps_w_Fractionating_Impeller_Up_to_500_Gallons_Per_Hour_Submersible_Water_Pumps-Danner_Mfg.-DN1159-FIWPSBUF-vi.html
     
    #1 growitnow, Feb 17, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 17, 2011
  2. mi5haha

    mi5haha Prolific Poster

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    Guess you may need a 75-100W NW pump to do that.
     
  3. Gerryd

    Gerryd Plant Guru Team
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    Hi,

    The danner seems like it would work fine. I also think you could DIY a rio the same way...

    Remember too that dwell time is also important for the c02 to totally diffuse into the water..

    I would think if you could plug an external NW into the rest of the plumbing for good distribution and the pump is powerful enough to cover an head loss, I think a good option to try anyway.

    Once of the things I like about the internal unit is I can see all the time:

    a. the bubble rate going into it
    b. the mist coming out of it
    c. the direction of the mist and merging with the rest of the flow

    So, is easy at a glance to see if something is off mechanically or not as it was...

    I think you need to be a pioneer here, bite the bullet and set one up..

    Honestly it may not be worth it as I paid I think < $30 for my latest rio 1k and took 5 mins to snip and it seems to work fine...the danner is like 4-5x the cost...plus it takes more effort to integrate with your system.

    The internal IS a bit harder to hide, but pros and cons as with everything....

    Hope this helps.
     
  4. growitnow

    growitnow Lifetime Charter Member
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    Many thanks. I do understand this in principle.

    But what is the practical implication in terms of options for how you might plumb a NW, or what type of NW (internal vs. external) one might integrate?
     
  5. mi5haha

    mi5haha Prolific Poster

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    1. independent internal NW pump, not relating to the filtering system;

    2. same power external NW pump, linking on the existing filtering system. NW on when CO2 and light on, canister's pump off; NW off when Co2 off, and the canister's pump on.

    3. smaller power external NW pump (let's say a 10W NW pump), linking on the existing water output pipe of the canister, running at the same time. that will make water flow stronger.
     
  6. Gerryd

    Gerryd Plant Guru Team
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    Well, the length of the plumbing for instance will impact dwell time so where the NW is placed can make a difference....

    Not really that much of a concern I guess...
     
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