Hair Algae I.D.

jaafaman

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This algae seems to have ridden into the tank with the purchase of the Hygrophila pinnatifida. It's easily removed, but pops back up after a couple of days, looking like a little "dust bunny" here and there, and so far is restricted to just the pinnatifida's older leaves. The little lumps you see on it appear to be small bladders but could just be lumps. And it appears to be dark, like beard algae.

It's a 29-gallon tank (although 12*24*20 only actually holds 25) at two months
65W, three-tube 6500K CF
Black Flourite covered w/Tahitian Moon black sand
Temp 76F/24C
Hardness and alkalinity both at a single degree
CO[SUB]2[/SUB] provided by DIY yeast, three 1/2-gallon in-line bottles, oldest replaced at two-day intervals, vented to mix with filter outflow of HOB for "mist effect"
Daily dosing of Flourish Iron (0.5 ml), FlorinMulti (2 drops) and PlantGuild Gold (2 drops)
Monthly root tabs
15% WC twice weekly, 50% once weekly
Flora: Hygrophila pinnatifida, Ludwigia arcuata, Ammania senegalensis, Ludwigia aromatica, Eleocharis parvula, Cryptocoryne wendtii var "Red" and an Amazon labelled as "Compacta" that I haven't had long enough to pin down an I.D. on yet
Fauna: 2 x Otocinclus affinis and 7 x Corydoras panda


The spots you see are a mix of mostly O[SUB]2[/SUB] with some of the misted CO[SUB]2[/SUB], and this shot is at the other end of the tank from the CO[SUB]2[/SUB] source:

View attachment 2522View attachment 2523
 

dutchy

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Looks like Staghorn to me, since it is branched and kind of thick strands, which can be caused by short NH4 spikes if you work in the substrate of the tank without doing a good size waterchange afterwards. Typically around two weeks later you get this algae. Tanks which also have low CO2 seem to be more sensitive.

What you could do is use Excel for some time, this will kill the algae. Do a good waterchange after tank maintainance. Also see if you can reduce your light with about one third, especially with your DIY CO2. Less light = less CO2 demand = less algae.
 

Biollante

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See If You Really Want An ID And/Or Help, If So Information Please

Hi,

My inclination is to agree with Dutchy that of course would be the smart thing…:cool: But then...:eek: Well I gotta be me...:p and no one has ever accused me of being smart:eek: and I see no reason to start at this late date...:p:D

Are the algae “slimy?” What do they smell like?:confused:

Lay a strand or two out on a paper towel and look closely (a magnifying glass would help), what do you see?

In addition to the lack of sanitize/quarantine protocol, unbalanced nutrients, ammonia spikes (or just plain high ammonia) and of course low or unstable CO2, what Dutchy said, seem to be the obvious.

It is always hard to tell from pictures, but your water looks like a bit of a stew. Some of these algae are indicators of unstable conditions and are trying to help get things back in balance.

Put some aquarium water in a small clear container of the water,
  • Stick your nose in and take a good whiff
    • What does it smell like?
      • Were this lake water, would you swim in this?
  • Hold it up to a bright light source,
    • what do you see? A magnifying glass would be handy.
    • What color or shade do you see?
    • Anything seem to be moving under their own power?
    • If motile, is the movement smooth or jerky?
Biollante
 
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jaafaman

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Gor! Perhaps I wasn't clear enough, or worded something improperly which threw you folks in the wrong direction. So let me begin again.

I change 15% of the water every other day, and on each third change (day 6) I replace 50% of the water. The tank itself smells of moist earth, and not only am I willing to swim in it I have drank from tanks to prove their condition. My bad for not mentioning the fact that the photos cover the rear of the tank against the black paint applied to the backside, hence the darker appearance, but I did mention the spots were bubbles - mostly oxygen that late in the day but with carbon dioxide mixed by the mist setup.

The carbon dioxide in DIY bottles is split into three containers, and on each water change the oldest single bottle is refreshed so as to keep the supply at a fairly constant level. That way I always have a fresh bottle, and recent bottle and a 5-day old bottle all reacting at once through the same water filter bottle and into the single line which feeds the tank. This avoids the usual up-and-down supply of a single bottle at whatever size as it ages.

The fauna population isn't burdensome in this tank, and TDSs never rise above the 450-600 range on a conductivity meter even with the minor supplementation. The change water starts out at 120 from the tap, and after the 50% change and the slightly larger supplementation that comes with it registers just about right at 400 in the tank. None of the fish have died, and their rations are a single Tetra Tab daily, and I find no cause for concern in assuming a nitrogen spike considering the frequency of water changes and the flora-to-fauna ratio.

The plants are still in the grow-out stage. The hairgrass was planted at the beginning, the arcuata added after a week, and the rest of the plants a week later. The tank is seven weeks old, and the plants haven't filled in enough for their first pruning yet. The little bit of work I have performed on the substrate comes in the form of splitting four API root tabs into quarters and pushing them down to the Flourite layer once a month, immediately before the 50% water change.

As to the lack of sanitation/quarantine, that's a fauly assumption based on a lack of info from me. Were you to see the condition of the LFS's plant tank here, your guess might be more along the lines of me actually using a bleach dip before their addition. By now, all of the leaves affected by the dip have been either melted (crypts) or removed (sword/pinnatifida) with the exception of the aromatica which I was lucky enough to pluck from the LFS's tank just as it was beginning to revert from emersed growth to immersed, and a couple of its emergent growth leaves are still present. The senegalensis apparently didn't mind the dip, much to my surprise.

I've dealt with brush algae on older growth in previous tanks before, but actually haven't seen this type before in any of my tanks. It does not smell, is easily pulled from the plants, is not slimy, motile, or has even spread to other plants in the tank. It's consistency, as I mentioned before, seems like little "dust bunnies" of hair that is neither tough nor too soft, and it appears to be one of the "red" algaes that we perceive as dark gray/black, like brush algae. I was hoping someone might recognize the stuff and make recommendations as to its handling, but apparently the information I provided wasn't sufficient for some reason.

Another bad move on my part is not telling you the pinnatifida sits right next to a heavy growth of the arcuata, and I'm thinking perhaps this is restricting the flow a bit too much in that corner. It's not suffering from BGA due to the circulation - yet. But I keep a close eye on the growth and color of the arcuata because I honestly expected to have cleared out some of it by now. The tank in the family room, an 80-gallon, isn't quite ready yet (new move after the Tornadoes that hit this area in late April), but when it is the senegalensis and the aromatica will come out (I had to snatch them while the opportunity existed). The idea is to stretch the arcuata area out a bit behind the sword and have the pinnatifida overshadowing that from behind, with the sword on one side as a bright green contrast to the arcuata and pinnatifida while the other end of the tank grows out the crypts, with the hairgrass as ground cover.

The light is concentrated over the left end of the tank, decreasing in intensity across to the crypts. Hopefully this will keep the crypts growing slowly and not overrun the tank or require constant trimming out of the runners.

Hopefully, this and the following shot of the tank itself may give you a better feel for the tank. The touch of algae on the back wall is a combo of green spot and dust algae, and the growth on the back wall is two weeks old. I alternate wiping the back glass with the left-side end pane on a weekly basis with the 50% changes to keep something around for the two otos, so what little you see on the left end is but a week old at this point. But even this algae only grows on the glass immediately around the light and doesn't touch the other end with less light. There is no BGA in those spots, and it usually takes the first week for the GSA to reach noticeable size, and as you can see on the back wall by the end of the second week it's only about the size of a grammar school pencil lead (the thick pencils they make for little hands to learn writing skills). The otos usually handle the softer dust algae and biofilm that grown in the meantime.

And for the sake of brevity, let's assume I have a little experience in handling tanks and not start with very basic troubleshooting. Although I'm new to the list, a decade ago I was known as Nestor10 to the APD and Apistogramma Mailing List, and under my real name of David Youngker I am one of the "founding fathers" of what started out as the AGA International Aquascaping Contest and Showcase...

[attachment=886:name]

take3.jpg
 
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Biollante

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If You Are Not Part Of The Solution You Must Be Precipitate

Hi David,

Information helps, so often these questions are asked in this way by people who really do not want the answers. The smell/swim/taste answer is helpful.

I apologize, I have no intention to offend any who ask honest questions, we Evilplantmonsters are lacking in the social graces,:eek: see disclaimer. :p
My psychic powers are limited and I only know what you share.:rolleyes:
Though my psychotic break remains.:eek:

I will stick by my diagnosis, including the quarantine, sanitize* or sterilize.
  • Personally I follow such protocols when moving between my own tanks and
  • all the more so when bringing anything in from the outside,
  • no matter how reputable, knowledgeable and decent the provider.
  • I admit that has offended.:(
Circulation may prove to be an issue, though my opinion it has little to do with this situation.

With the added information that the tank is seven weeks old it reinforces my opinion (thereby my agreement with Dutchy) that ammonia spikes are the proximate cause. Further the system is indeed unstable and the chance introduction of the as yet undetermined algae met conditions ripe for exploitation.:gw

Given your level of experience and willingness to do the water changes I suspect you will beat the algae in short order with your water change routine. You might consider doing a couple of extra 50% water changes.
With the water changes it is probable that in addition to mechanical removal, sodium percarbonate or hydrogen peroxide applied directly to the algae can hasten its demise.
:)

The algae is one of three, for more specific help I need to know the following::confused:


  1. Are the algae slimy to the touch?
  2. What do the algae smell like?
  3. Lay a strand or two out on a paper towel and look closely (a magnifying glass would help),
    1. What do you see?

Good luck,
:cool:

Biollante
*Sanitize in this case does not question your sanitary conditions, but a specific regimen to reduce the hitchhikers in lieu of, or in addition to quarantine. Personally I favor a 20-ppm KMnO[SUB]4[/SUB] solution, with the time varying with the plant.
 
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jaafaman

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Jun 27, 2011
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I am not offended, and pointed out the true lack of info on my part as cause for the confusion, so don't worry there.

The algae isn't slimy to the touch, and unfortunately at 56 my sense of smell is no longer acute enough for such a small sample. As you can see in the photo, I let the stuff go for an extra cleaning to try to obtain a significant enough portion for sampling, but being a smoker doesn't help at all either.

I used to have a small school microscope, but it and most of my equipment were waxed when one of the tornadoes wiped out the storage facility I had everything in during a four-year stretch in apartments. Right now, the best I can come up with are photos from a Canon CoolPix (hate the color renditions) and direct observations with a small pocket 100x "microscope" from Radio Shack, of all places. Rather than being able to provide a microphotograph, the best I can do is describe it as about human hair thickness with high uniformity broken in about 12-15 mm "nodes" terminated by a small, single mm-sized bulb or lump.

This small bedroom tank is actually my first foray into the world of Flourite, which I went with simply to match the black covering sand rather than my usual Dan Quackenbush kitty litter "understrate" w/white sand, so the tank is a little more dependent on water column supplementation and a chance for me to play around with those issues. What's taking time with the 80-gallon is developing enough mineralized topsoil to make an attempt at that as well - I underestimated the amount of volume loss with the first batch and have to generate more. It will be blended with what little Hartz Mountain I have left as well as laterite for iron rather than my usual ironite, but that's more likely to be a later story.

I have already decided to up the volume and frequency of water changes to reflect my usual habits when raising Apistos - 10-15% daily with at least a 30% change twice weekly, so it'll be more like 15/15/30/15/15/30 on a three-day cycle. I don't wish to add shrimp or anything other than the Otos for cleanup as these Pandas have already graced me with a few egg/fry, but the tank is not yet mature enough to support the fry on their own. Normally it's not a problem with my Pandas because they're not the most prolific of Corys, but I don't want either shrimp or snails snacking on what little the Pandas produce going into this.

"With the water changes it is probable that in addition to mechanical removal, sodium percarbonate or hydrogen peroxide applied directly to the algae can hasten its demise." I can obtain 6% peroxide formula rather than the usual 3% store shelf, and I assume this means lowering the water level enough to apply the solution manually with a cotton swab or so?

And I do appreciate both your position and the difficulties of long-distance diagnoses as well as your willingness to make the attempt...