This site is supported by the advertisements on it, please disable your AdBlocker so we can continue to provide you with the quality content you expect.
  1. We are after as many aquarium plant images that we can get, doing so will assist us in completing the aquarium plant database.

    https://barrreport.com/threads/aquatic-plant-images-wanted.14374/
    Dismiss Notice

External CO2 reactor is restricting filtration to much, need tips.

Discussion in 'CO2 Enrichment' started by Gilles, Mar 18, 2013.

  1. Gilles

    Gilles Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    So i've got an external reactor, and AquaMedic 1000 to be precise. I have modified the connections (bored it out) to allow for more flow and i've attached PVC bends (not knees) to allow better flow through the reactor. However, with my current pump (JBL CristalProfi e1501) with a rated "0-flow" of 369 US gallon/hour i see it has very little flow left when it comes to the tank after it went through the reactor. This is seriously affecting the filtration capacity of my aquasoil leaving much debris on the substrate, hence; i have to little flow.

    Unfortunately i don't have space for a sump or anything of that kind. Today i am expecting an Eheim 2178 (thermo pump) with a rated 490 gallon/hour output. I am going to replace the JBL CristalProfi e1501 with this filter since it also has thermo inside.

    So that leaves me with what to do with my external reactor. I have the following hardware available:
    - JBL CristalProfi e1501
    - Eheim 1250 pump (28 watt/317 gallon/hour)
    - Eheim 1260 pump (60 watt/317 gallon/hour)
    - Eheim 1262 pump (80 watt/317 gallon/hour)

    Please advise me with your choice of scenario before i start modifying my tank :)

    I could...

    1) Just use the 2178 as main filter and see how it goes, also feeding the reactor.
    2) If scenario 1 fails (it still isn't enough flow) remove the impeller from the Eheim 2178 (leaving thermo options) and use an Eheim external pump (12** or Compact version) to power the pump(*)
    3) Use the e1501 as reactor feeding pump (without any media in the canister)
    4) Completely remove the e1501 and use an Eheim 12** pump to power the CO2 reactor. With or without Needle Wheel Mod?

    Scenario 2:
    I could put the Eheim pump in front of the filter to push the water through. This would make it easier to prime, add the reactor behind the filter.
    I could also put the Eheim behind the filter, e.g. pulling the water through. This would make it possible to add CO2 with any form of Needle wheel mod, i could remove the reactor since i'd be needle wheeling the co2.

    Scenario 3 and 4 would require an extra outflow and inflow.

    I am probably overthinking the whole deal...
     
  2. Gilles

    Gilles Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    p.s. i could also go for a CO2 diffusor disc, like the ADA Pollen Glass Beetle 50mm for my 100 gallon?
    Are ADA diffusors worth the extra costs compared to cheap ebay look a likes?
     
  3. Yo-han

    Yo-han Guru Class Expert

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2011
    Messages:
    285
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    Yes, the ADA ones last longer and produce smaller bubbles.

    About the CO2 reactor and filter problem. I had the same problem and placed an extra pump like your idea with the Eheim 12**. My filter is runner as well so it is only helping, I didn't removed the rotor from my filter. It does 100 times better now.
     
  4. Gilles

    Gilles Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    I have been Googling this since i posted the thread, and there are tons of idea's on the web; reactor (like i have prebuild, in 100 different DIY ideas, Rex Grig reactor or Cerges' reactor, inline atomizer (UP Aqua atomizer or this new model), cheap ceramic discs, ADA ceramic discs and even a guy who made an inline atomizer from a disc :)

    All has given me a lot of food for thought. I think i have the UP Atomizer laying around at home, so i will be trying that first when i have time. @Yohan, if i get you right, have it like this:
    Tank -> Filter (running) -> Eheim pump 12** -> Reactor -> Tank ?
     
  5. dutchy

    dutchy Plant Guru Team
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2009
    Messages:
    2,280
    Likes Received:
    4
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    I didn't notice your post the first time, but anyway:

    I have two Eheim 2078e's (same pump as the 2178, 486 gph each) on my tank, one has a bored out AM1000. I can connect my computer to the filter which tells me the actual flow. The loss because of the AM1000 is 200 lph (52 gph) which is acceptable to me.

    Even without the AM1000 the flow is only around 1000 lph (263 gph) using recommended Eheim filter media so the flow reduction is 20%.

    The reason of the loss in the AM1000 is the reduction in water flow through the reactor. It's wide, so the velocity of the water flow decreases considerably. It takes a lot of energy (pump capacity) to speed it up again. A longer but smaller reactor could do better because the drop in velocity of the water flow is less while maintaining efficiency.
     
    #5 dutchy, Mar 18, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 18, 2013
  6. mi5haha

    mi5haha Prolific Poster

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2008
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    that is the trade off of that type of external reactors. Small diameter water input and output, decreasing the flow capacity almost by half. the mechanism is to create a "high" water pressure inside so it can dissolve high capacity of Co2 injected. 2000 l/h pump capacity is preferable if a descent water outlet capacity is desired.
     
  7. Yo-han

    Yo-han Guru Class Expert

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2011
    Messages:
    285
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    Almost: Tank -> Filter (running) -> Reactor -> pump (2200 lph Wave Stream) -> UV -> Tank. And parallel to the Reactor I've a external heater:cool: That is why I run them both, quite some equipment to reduce flow.
     
  8. Gilles

    Gilles Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    So you pull the water through the reactor.. interesting. Why not push it through?
     
  9. Yo-han

    Yo-han Guru Class Expert

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2011
    Messages:
    285
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    It was easier to cut the hose here and place it in between:p I don't think it matters where you place it. Only rule I've: place everything after the filter, this way it stays cleaner. Never cleaned the CO2 reactor in 3 years, only the UV unit and heater 1-2 a year to keep them working well.
     
  10. Gilles

    Gilles Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    You still have the Eheim 2080 right? This does about 1700 liters/hour and you added a 2200l/hour pump after it? Do you think the increase in flow is mainly because of the wave stream or the combination of both pumps?

    I thought i'd still had the UP Atomizer lying at home, but i've trashed it in the past so i ordered 2 new ones to try it out. First i want to try out all scenario's without redoing my plumbing as much as possible.

    However, the new pump is wider then the previous one so i have to redo my cabinet anyway. I also noticed that i could remove 2x 90 degrees bends in my spraybar if i drill a hole closer to the spraybar (in my canopy).
    Thesame for the overflow so this will help a lot. In total 4 bends of 90 degrees eliminated... But, therefore i have to redo the plumbing, so first i'll make a new cabinet. By the time i am finished with that the new atomizer will be in.
     
  11. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,693
    Likes Received:
    726
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
  12. Gilles

    Gilles Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    Yeah i think if the atomizer won't work as expected i'll go for the cerges' reactor. Not only because it doesn't flow from top to bottom, but also since the idea speaks to me and i already have a clear canister at home which i originally intended to use as a sillicate filter.

    The only thing i have to figure out is how to fit it into my cabinet since i have very little room. I have a 50cm wide cabinet, which need to fit aquariumcomputer, dosing pumps, canister filter, cerges reactor, powerbar for aquariumcomputer...

    I need to find a way to minimize flow impact on the cerges' reactor (e.g. use bends instead of knees) and maybe add an extra pump and/or UV sterilizer into the game. Any way or the other, it will be packed in there :)
     
  13. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,693
    Likes Received:
    726
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    I have long moved away from cramped over loaded stuff under the aquariums.
    Simpler is almost always better IME. Less things to maintain and go wrong.
    There are exceptions, but few.
     
  14. Gilles

    Gilles Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    Hehe, not to mention i don't have the heater anymore since it is incorporated into my filter.
     
  15. Gerryd

    Gerryd Plant Guru Team
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2007
    Messages:
    5,624
    Likes Received:
    20
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    As a software developer I live by the KISS method whenever possible :)

    I find it works well when applied to this hobby as well lol
     
  16. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,693
    Likes Received:
    726
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    As far as no# of species and design, this also applies.
     
  17. Gilles

    Gilles Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    As a software developer myself (hehe) i tend to over think problems, over engineer my solutions and end up with the first idea i had which actually worked and was dead simple :)
     
  18. scottward

    scottward Guru Class Expert

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2007
    Messages:
    958
    Likes Received:
    10
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    Gilles - sorry if I missed it but did you check that there was nothing restricting the *input* of your pump? There isn't anything stuck in your intake strainers? No hidden kinks (that could also be clogged up with crud) anywhere?

    The flow through my AM1000 dropped off a while back, back when I was using hoses before converting to a drilled tank, and I found there was a kink down behind the tank where crud had acumulated and was killing off the flow quite a lot.

    Just a thought.

    The flow has always been poor...or just recently become poor?

    Scott.
     
  19. Gilles

    Gilles Lifetime Members
    Lifetime Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    2:22 PM
    Don't know scott, that is just the point. I will check this weekend.
     
Loading...

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice