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Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

Discussion in 'Advanced Strategies and Fertilization' started by Spar, Nov 8, 2005.

  1. Spar

    Spar Guru Class Expert

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    OK, hopefully there aren't too many kinks in this thing, but as far as I could tell it worked fairly well. The amount of options the user has to enter should make this very easy for them.

    Let me know what you think. I will put in some new products (like Fleet) soon. Just wanted to at least put up a beta version first.

    I think there are some issues with the Ca & Mg adding if you have a low GH when using CaCO3... some reason comes up as 13:1 Ca:Mg ratio. Has to do with the molecular weight formula I entered into it... but most importantly the actual increase to dGH is accurate regardless at a 3:1 ratio.

    http://www.fwstingrays.com/DosingCalculator.htm

    ^^^ Click on the "Beginners Edition" link.

    edit>>> and the instructions aren't detailed at yet... that is pending... and, I haven't done anything with the co2/wpg factor yet... that is pending as well. So entering in the pH & KH to get co2 and the lighting part does nothing as of yet.

    was thinking about doing a factor like:
    4 = 100%
    3 = 90%
    2 = 70%
    1 = 60%
    0 = 50%
    As far as dosing amounts go... so you would dose 50% as much as EI recommends with low light and low co2.
     
    #1 Spar, Nov 8, 2005
  2. PMC

    PMC Junior Poster

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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    Cliff,

    You put a lot of work into this and it shows! I think you're looking for detailed comments from a beginner's point of view, so here goes:

    1. I would re-order your tables to make it match the process of thinking through that the aquarist is probably taking:
    a. Instructions. To simplify the length of this, you may want to include in this section the EI Method Dosage Recommendations. You could also make the Instructions section a separate worksheet with a tab (see "g" below) to shorten up the worksheet for printing purposes.
    b. Current tank stats, etc...
    c. What products are you using?
    d. Dosing Scheduler
    e. Dosing Summary
    f. Recommendations (I would make this a separate section)
    g. Your 3 converters plus decimal table could be separate work sheets with tabs at the bottom.

    Going over each table (in my order):
    2. Current Tank Stats
    a. I would simplify your layout from little tables to one main table:
    1. Measurement system Menu Choice
    2 Gallons of net tank water #
    3. GH Degrees Tap Water # Result with CO2* #
    4. KH Degrees Tap Water # Result with CO2* #
    5. Tap pH Water Tap Water # Result with CO2* #
    * If not inserting CO2, please retype test results from first column.
    6. Tank Light Wattage #
    7. Day you do weekly water change: Menu Choice
    8. Percentage of Water you normally change #
    9. If making a fertilizer formula/solution: what size bottle will you be using # (I think you can assume aquarist will figure out the conversion from cups/ozs to ml). or you can have a pull down option for 1 cup/250 ml that would be self-explanatory. I think the simpler the page the better the outcome will be.

    I suggest not asking for smallest teaspoon measurement as I think you should assume if you're in the hobby this deep, you're willing to get the proper tools. However, I would make a big note on this table that you urge user to not assume measuring spoons are accurate and to double check.

    I'm not sure the CO2/wpg and the CO2 ppm tables are that helpful here, Though you could insert the ppm result and the recommendation to add CO2 in a little table at the bottom of this section or refer user to Recommendations section.

    3. What products do you have access to:
    a. Column with Solution/Dry: how about relabeling as "Choose Solution or Dry"
    b. I'm assuming you mean teaspoons by the "t" in Solution Factors. If you are, just write tsp to clarify.
    c. After Normal Dy Dosage insert (tsp).

    4, Dosing Scheduler
    a. I would round your ml's, so instead of, say, 5 1/5 make it 5.

    Hope this was helpful. It's looking good.

    Peter
     
    #2 PMC, Nov 9, 2005
  3. stcyrwm@adelphia.net

    stcyrwm@adelphia.net Prolific Poster

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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    One specific question. Under traces you have "Flourish Trace" listed as an option. Isn't this different than the regular Seachem "Flourish" most folks use for their traces? Is this a mistake?

    Thanks for all the hard work, Bill
     
    #3 stcyrwm@adelphia.net, Nov 11, 2005
  4. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    This looks very good.

    Is it possible to add a pH value to chug out a CO2ppm value?
    Also, adding the GH part will be useful.
    And adding a KH equilivalent baking soda dosing will help also.

    Otherwise it's looks very close to being done.

    From there some graphing options for predicting the max min outcomes.

    Great work!

    Tom Barr
     
    #4 Tom Barr, Nov 11, 2005
  5. wob

    wob Junior Poster

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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    Spar,
    I gave your beginners spreadsheet a testdrive in OpenOffice tonight and it worked quite well. This is exactly what a beginner needs, just type in a few values and it does everything else for you. Great work! :)

    Would it be possible to add in a switch between dKH/GH and ppm format? I think this may help it more use friendly.

    I am definitely keeping this tool, it is by far the easiest one I've used!

    Robert
     
    #5 wob, Nov 12, 2005
  6. Spar

    Spar Guru Class Expert

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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    Thanks all for the comments! I haven't had a chance to implement any of the suggestions due to work load being rough lately, but definately will soon.

    To answer a couple of the questions though:

    Right now I have the GH and KH builder set to only allow additional GH or KH *if* the KH in tap water is below 3d (54ppm) and if GH in tap water is below 7d (126ppm). Since a beginner may be confused if we gave them an option to choose what KH and GH they want, I figured just ensuring it was in a safe range would be enough. If you want to try out the calculations on it, just lower the Tap Water KH and GH below 3 and 7, respectively. My tap water is 2 dKH and 5dGH, so it shows up on my calculator.

    I will also get those numbers rounded for sure. Some are rounded to 1/10 place right now, but you are right that it would be prettier if rounded to the whole number, and wouldn't flux the dosings much at all.

    Tom, the co2 calculator is already there, on the mid-left part of the spreadsheet. Where you put in your tanks parameters for GH, KH, and pH.

    I am still looking for opinions on how to decrease the EI dosing recommendations for lower light and co2 levels. Tom, you may be a good source for figuring that out, as I have no experience on low light / low co2 tanks. I am just looking for what % of EI recommended dosings would someone dose in a mid-light/co2 tank and low-light/co2 tank. 75%/50%?

    stcyrwm -- "Flourish Trace" and just "Flourish" are the same product. Technically, I think you are correct in that the bottle doesn't specify "Trace", but that is what it is.

    PMC -- you had a lot of good inputs on the design of the spreadsheet, and will be implementing most of those. I do however like the actual dosing schedule on top since that is the primary purpose of the spreadsheet. Also, the Solution vs. Dry is no longer a choice as it was/is on the advanced version. It is decided based on what the smallest measuring spoon willing to dose with is. If the result is to dose 1/16t when you are only willing to dose with a minimum of a 1/8t spoon, then it automatically switches to a Solution.

    Most of the other grams and ppm options are soon to be implemented as well.
     
    #6 Spar, Nov 12, 2005
  7. metasyntax

    metasyntax Junior Poster

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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    I've also tried this in OpenOffice.org 2.0, and it works great.

    It would be nice to have an option for TMG for traces as well.

    great tool, tanks for all your work on it.
     
    #7 metasyntax, Nov 17, 2005
  8. stcyrwm@adelphia.net

    stcyrwm@adelphia.net Prolific Poster

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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    Clif,

    I double checked and they actually make a product called Flourish Trace which is different than Flourish. I know from reading the boards that newbies sometimes get these confused because of course Flourish is often recommended for "traces". From what I've read on the boards Flourish Trace is not very helpful. Here's a quote from the Seachem website reffering to the two of them:

    "Flourish Trace™ supplies a broad range of trace elements demonstrated to be necessary for proper plant health and growth (see right panel for signs of deficiencies). Trace elements are normally depleted by utilization, oxidation and precipitation. The latter two processes occur more rapidly than with other micronutrients. This makes it important to restore trace elements on a regular basis. Flourish Trace™ may be used alone or in conjunction with Flourish™. Best results are obtained when both are used."

    I hope this is helpful. Again I appreciate all the work you've put into this.

    Sincerely, Bill
     
    #8 stcyrwm@adelphia.net, Nov 17, 2005
  9. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    Okay found it.

    Lighting will be hard, but not impossible either.
    We will neeed to specify what type of light, T5/PC/MH/MH-HQI are in another class than
    NO FL's. A few use VHO's.

    I'd keep the VHO's and NO's together. Old technology. Ice cap can claim all they want, but it's too pricy now relative to PC/T5 trends/bulb availability and cost as well as efficiency.

    Generally what I do with less light etc, is go to a smaller dosing, same frequency, but it's hard to say really, you have a lot of wiggle room.

    You can go less frequency but same dosing, I often give this advice.

    So you have two distinct paths that will do a similar thing.

    At 2w/gal, 2 x a week EI dosing is plenty.
    At 1.5 w/gal, 1x week can be done, but I'd perfer 2x a week even there.

    Non CO2 has huge wiggle room.

    It's hard to say, but adjust the dosing to once a week, 10X less than EI.

    So to a 75 gal non CO2, I'd add 1/4 teaspoon KNO3 once a week, 1/8th of the PO4(this assumes more NO3 from fish waste, reltative to a CO2 enriched tank), and about 5-10mls of traces. Add 1/2 teaspoon on ce a week of the GH Barr's off Greg's site or....SeaChem Equilibrium or your own mix of MgSO4/CaSO4/K2SO4/FeSO4/MnSO4.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
    #9 Tom Barr, Nov 17, 2005
  10. aussietanker

    aussietanker Junior Poster

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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    hi all ...

    as a new subscriber ... and a total klutz at most things chemical ... i really, really liked this "calculator" ....

    i used both the beginner and the more advanced one ... i liked bits of both of them ... but the beginners one best ... (it took into account my initial and current tank water parameters as seperate issues or states .. whereas i wasn't sure that the advanced one was doing that ... so wasn't sure whether to enter my water as it is from the tank ... or as it is since i altered it in the tank with GH/KH + additives etc )...

    i gathered that t = teaspoon ... but i think that it should be spelt out ... i couldn't understand why when i put 1/4 t as my min acceptable measure that many of the recommended doses came out as 1/8 t ... i think that should have some comment ..

    also, i think that to many europeans, aussies and most of those those from asia ... the use of the term "metric" and then only having UK Gallons and USA Gallons in the drop down list is very misleading ...

    i may be wrong ... and totally shot down in flames here ... but my understanding is that the term metric refers to the metric (ie based on 1 metre or 10 centimetres, 1 kilogram, 1 litre type measures) system ... whereas both UK and USA gallons are Imperial measures (ie based on the imperial (1 foot or 12 inches , 1 pound weight, 1 gallon liquid etc ) ... now i may be wrong ... so i spent a long time clicking it trying to get the litres to show because it read "metric" ... and thinking that there was an error somewhere ...whereas what it really meant was either USA OR UK Gallons, not what most of us outside the USA regard as metric ... ie a litres drop down list ...

    perhaps it's just a matter of changing the labels .. most of us that use metric can readily calculate our tanks in usa gallons anyway ... so it's no problem for most of us to use USA gallons ...

    this is not in any way meant as a critisism ... i think that its the greatest little tool ever ... please keep on working on it ...

    and i hope that i mentioned that i really liked it! ... :)

    thanks
    aussietanker
     
    #10 aussietanker, Nov 20, 2005
  11. freemann

    freemann Junior Poster

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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    Yes this calculator looks really promising, people really need a thing like that.
    Could Tom or someone else verify that the amounts calculated are right?
    Also I have to agree on the metric implementation in Europe we all use that here. Plus the addition of the ability to add Gh readings up to 25 Gh maybe?
    I have 13 Gh here and there is no way to input this.
    This could be super thanks for the good work

    Freemann :)
     
    #11 freemann, Nov 20, 2005
  12. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    Yes, definely need a metric system, I do not think in acres, feet, gallons.
    The metric system is how we define ppm, mg/l etc.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
    #12 Tom Barr, Nov 20, 2005
  13. Spar

    Spar Guru Class Expert

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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    So what was the consensus on changing the Metric indicator?

    Just change the wording to "Imperial System"?

    Should I add a Gallons vs Litres option as well?
     
    #13 Spar, Nov 22, 2005
  14. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Re: Dosing Schedule Creator - Beginners Edition - beta

    I think the liters gal issues is about it and if you really want, have a table for teaspoon to milliliter conversions also.

    If ther TMG question in another post is relevant to this, let me know.
    It's still not going to help anyone, but if they want to know what theya re putting in, they can see, but it will not correlate with the test kits at all nor plant health.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
    #14 Tom Barr, Nov 22, 2005
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