Hi all
I'm new here and hobby, have zero experience and plan a 500l high tech tank ( wont go there ) read/reading lots.
(I'm dyslexic so I apologise for bad spelling and grammar from the start)
Started this off else where AWF and UKAPS but would also value you wisdom and input.
The plants (Those beautiful green/red ones the name of which i fail to pronounce let alone spell ATM) all they need is the right ecosystem to grow and they will. All I need to do is to optimise that ecosystem and they will. Its all about getting the ecosystem right.
So hears my thought- ( mainly copied and pasted from my other threads. )
We are after the CO2 level getting to the ideal level fast then staying there without becoming toxic to the inhabitants off the tank but high enough for optimum plant growth, but we end up with a bell curve OFC
so we are after a Table top not a bell curve ideally
[img2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"custom","src":"http://www.aquascapingworld.com/attachments/graph-co2-levels-png.12023/[/img]
( sorry just a quick job)
So ignore the cost for a moment. and just have two soleniods, needle valves, Inline Atomizer CO2 Diffuser etc and just have one soleniod switch off once the "Just right" CO2 level is reach.
ovbiously you would need to play with the BBS until you hit the sweat spot
posted elsewhere thought a bit, slept on it and-
If folks are not doing it why not.
heres my take on it.
the CO2 gets into the water at a constant rate the diffusser as far as I'm aware its on or off, yes their is the pH controller method but that has issues with its use. but the C02 injection method is on or off we don't have a throttle on it the controller just switches it on and off.
My analogy
Our CO2 level is a plane on the ground,with limited fuel. we have mountain to over (we wont the CO2 at optimal level fast for obvious reasons) the engines can be on or off no throttle control. We have two engines. we can set the engine thrust (BBS) on the ground. we need 50% thrust (4 BBS) on one engine to cruise at 10,oo0 feet ( 25-30 ppm CO2) to to take off and clear the mountain we need both engines on at 50% (8 BBS combined). So we take off both engines ON reach cruising altitude switch ONE OFF. get close to our destination. switch other engine off. (or plane runs out of fuel in analogy). this would give us the ability to fly making a TABLE TOP flight giving max range (Fine control)
---------------------- ian_m said:
You are forgetting that CO2 is always lost via surface agitation and loss rate is proportional to amount of agitation and CO2 level in the water.
So you start injecting CO2 and level rises but so does the amount lost at the surface
not forgetting the idea is just just at its Alpha stage didnt wont to start with a thread too long, some just read a bit then move on.
It works so why change it. Triumph did that with there 750 Bonneville for years, great for spares. But....
but im jumping in at the very deep end with a 500l tank ( wont go there also [img2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"custom","src":"http://www.ukaps.org/forum/styles/default/xenforo/clear.png[/img])
So looking at an inline duffusser its rated up to 500l so the the duffusser its going to be at its limit trying to get the CO2 levels to an optimal level, as will be losing CO2 as soon as it get in tank - equilibrium with the external enviroment etc etc.So it will take longer.
So using two soleniods etc will get there faster hit optimium level for CO2 then switch one off. then one maintains the optimum level.
foxfish said:
I feel this slow build up is not to shocking for my tank inmates but equally it is simple and effective.
Yes good point but its the CO2 levels that drive respiration ( a take it as read for fish its the same as humans since we evolved from fish millions of years ago) the water isnt o2 deficient. the fish gupp not for O2 but to get rid off CO2 respiratory alkalosis
( although the pH change might effect the max percentage O2 saturation just like temp does, but irreverent its the CO2 levels thats gets the fish) same as in appollo 13 it was the rising CO2 levels that treated the astronauts not the lack of O2, have they made a CO2 scrubber in space.
its not like jumping in a cold pool of water, just get in it twice as fast thats all.
-------------
ian_m said:
For bigger tanks you will not be able to get decent CO2 distribution flow optimal levels using just one filter/spray bar/diffuser regardless of the CO2 levels you inject. Most people on bigger tanks end up having to use two spray bars, two filters and two diffusers in order to get optimal CO2 replied
Planning (got some, still to finalise everything) on having Two fluval FX6 ( output 2000l/h with media, got one working on bog wood in bin, with carbon[img2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"custom","src":"http://www.ukaps.org/forum/styles/default/xenforo/clear.png[/img]), one with Inline diffuser in INTAKE ( have read up on it [img2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"custom","src":"http://www.ukaps.org/forum/styles/default/xenforo/clear.png[/img]) and also and independent loop on Eheim 3000+ for two external 300Watt heaters.
Thinking of having the 'Thrust' inline diffuser on this independent loop, should get the CO2 levels to optimal levels pretty quick IMO
Your thoughts feedback welcome
Thanks
Zeus
edit - Inline Atomizer CO2 Diffuser not diffuser
I'm new here and hobby, have zero experience and plan a 500l high tech tank ( wont go there ) read/reading lots.
(I'm dyslexic so I apologise for bad spelling and grammar from the start)
Started this off else where AWF and UKAPS but would also value you wisdom and input.
The plants (Those beautiful green/red ones the name of which i fail to pronounce let alone spell ATM) all they need is the right ecosystem to grow and they will. All I need to do is to optimise that ecosystem and they will. Its all about getting the ecosystem right.
So hears my thought- ( mainly copied and pasted from my other threads. )
We are after the CO2 level getting to the ideal level fast then staying there without becoming toxic to the inhabitants off the tank but high enough for optimum plant growth, but we end up with a bell curve OFC
so we are after a Table top not a bell curve ideally
[img2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"custom","src":"http://www.aquascapingworld.com/attachments/graph-co2-levels-png.12023/[/img]
( sorry just a quick job)
So ignore the cost for a moment. and just have two soleniods, needle valves, Inline Atomizer CO2 Diffuser etc and just have one soleniod switch off once the "Just right" CO2 level is reach.
ovbiously you would need to play with the BBS until you hit the sweat spot
posted elsewhere thought a bit, slept on it and-
If folks are not doing it why not.
heres my take on it.
the CO2 gets into the water at a constant rate the diffusser as far as I'm aware its on or off, yes their is the pH controller method but that has issues with its use. but the C02 injection method is on or off we don't have a throttle on it the controller just switches it on and off.
My analogy
Our CO2 level is a plane on the ground,with limited fuel. we have mountain to over (we wont the CO2 at optimal level fast for obvious reasons) the engines can be on or off no throttle control. We have two engines. we can set the engine thrust (BBS) on the ground. we need 50% thrust (4 BBS) on one engine to cruise at 10,oo0 feet ( 25-30 ppm CO2) to to take off and clear the mountain we need both engines on at 50% (8 BBS combined). So we take off both engines ON reach cruising altitude switch ONE OFF. get close to our destination. switch other engine off. (or plane runs out of fuel in analogy). this would give us the ability to fly making a TABLE TOP flight giving max range (Fine control)
---------------------- ian_m said:
You are forgetting that CO2 is always lost via surface agitation and loss rate is proportional to amount of agitation and CO2 level in the water.
So you start injecting CO2 and level rises but so does the amount lost at the surface
not forgetting the idea is just just at its Alpha stage didnt wont to start with a thread too long, some just read a bit then move on.
It works so why change it. Triumph did that with there 750 Bonneville for years, great for spares. But....
but im jumping in at the very deep end with a 500l tank ( wont go there also [img2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"custom","src":"http://www.ukaps.org/forum/styles/default/xenforo/clear.png[/img])
So looking at an inline duffusser its rated up to 500l so the the duffusser its going to be at its limit trying to get the CO2 levels to an optimal level, as will be losing CO2 as soon as it get in tank - equilibrium with the external enviroment etc etc.So it will take longer.
So using two soleniods etc will get there faster hit optimium level for CO2 then switch one off. then one maintains the optimum level.
foxfish said:
I feel this slow build up is not to shocking for my tank inmates but equally it is simple and effective.
Yes good point but its the CO2 levels that drive respiration ( a take it as read for fish its the same as humans since we evolved from fish millions of years ago) the water isnt o2 deficient. the fish gupp not for O2 but to get rid off CO2 respiratory alkalosis
( although the pH change might effect the max percentage O2 saturation just like temp does, but irreverent its the CO2 levels thats gets the fish) same as in appollo 13 it was the rising CO2 levels that treated the astronauts not the lack of O2, have they made a CO2 scrubber in space.
its not like jumping in a cold pool of water, just get in it twice as fast thats all.
-------------
ian_m said:
For bigger tanks you will not be able to get decent CO2 distribution flow optimal levels using just one filter/spray bar/diffuser regardless of the CO2 levels you inject. Most people on bigger tanks end up having to use two spray bars, two filters and two diffusers in order to get optimal CO2 replied
Planning (got some, still to finalise everything) on having Two fluval FX6 ( output 2000l/h with media, got one working on bog wood in bin, with carbon[img2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"custom","src":"http://www.ukaps.org/forum/styles/default/xenforo/clear.png[/img]), one with Inline diffuser in INTAKE ( have read up on it [img2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"custom","src":"http://www.ukaps.org/forum/styles/default/xenforo/clear.png[/img]) and also and independent loop on Eheim 3000+ for two external 300Watt heaters.
Thinking of having the 'Thrust' inline diffuser on this independent loop, should get the CO2 levels to optimal levels pretty quick IMO
Your thoughts feedback welcome
Thanks
Zeus
edit - Inline Atomizer CO2 Diffuser not diffuser
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