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Co2 Setup Questions

Discussion in 'General Plant Topics' started by shane, May 20, 2007.

  1. shane

    shane Lifetime Charter Member
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    I am currently using (2) Eheim cannister filters for my 58 gallon planted tank. I have an Eheim 2215 being used to push water through a Aqua Medic 1000 CO2 reactor. With a bubble rate of about 1 bubble/sec out of the AM1000 and the AM1000 connected on the input of the Eheim 2215 I see what I presume to be CO2 build up in the AM1000 (the AM1000 is not completely full of water but partially water and partially CO2) after a few hours of operation once the CO2 turns on in the morning. I am assuming this CO2 buildup in the AM1000 reactor is due to not enough water flow? Is this a correct assumption? The Eheim 2215 is connected to a Cal Aqua Labs pipe. It provides deeper water movement

    I do have a drop checker in the tank and it reads green all the time - both during the day and night. I was expecting the drop checker show more of a blue color in the morning. But perhaps the built up CO2 that is in the reactor is being dissolved into the water all night long. Every morning the AM1000 is fully filled with water. The CO2 turns on 1 hour before the lights turn on and 1 hour before the lights turn off. Lights are on 9 hours/day.

    The 2nd Eheim cannister is a Pro II 2028 connected to a ADA P-6 lily pipe. This pipe pretty much provides shallow water movement.

    Lately the fish in the tank are hanging around the surface of the tank in the mornings. They are breathing hard. By the way, they are (4) discus.

    So my question is what should I do to remedy the fish gasping for air and the build up of CO2 in the AM1000?

    I have a Eheim Wet/Dry 2229 sitting around collecting dust. What are some thoughts of using this Wet/Dry filter in place of the 2215? I would assume this would take care of the fish gasping problem (O2 rich water out of the 2229) but will probably have to pump more CO2 into the tank. Any thoughts? The 2229 can also push alot more water as well. It may fix the CO2 buildup problem in the AM1000? I should be able to dissolve more CO2 through the AM1000.

    Any thoughts are welcomed....
     
  2. shane

    shane Lifetime Charter Member
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    Anybody know if one can put on 17mm input/output fittings on the AM1000?
     
  3. PeterGwee

    PeterGwee Lifetime Charter Member
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    Shane, do you shut the CO2 off at night or going 24/7? You should really shut it off and make sure you have some moderate surface movement so that the O2 does not drop to dangerous levels.

    Regards,
    Peter Gwee
     
  4. shane

    shane Lifetime Charter Member
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    The CO2 turns on 1 hour before the lights do and the CO2 turns off 1 hour before the lights turn off. Therefore, the CO2 is on 9 hours per day. The P-9 lily pipe does provide some surface water movement. I do not know if it is enough though.
     
  5. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
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    Shane,
    It's easier to simply add more surface turbulence.
    You'll lose some CO2, but so what.
    You can simply add a tad more if needed.

    This will give you plenty of exchange for O2 at night, and prevent any issues.
    During the day, the plants will add plenty.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  6. shane

    shane Lifetime Charter Member
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    Thanks Tom,

    Is there any reason to worry about the CO2 build up in the AM1000? Is this something I should fix or just leave as is?

    In terms of increasing surface movement, I can either reduce the water level to create more movement and splashing, or add a power head. What would you suggest?
     
  7. Professor Myers

    Professor Myers Guru Class Expert

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    Am 1000

    Shane, The 2028 is better suited for the AM 1000, but you will have to adjust the flow to 250 gph. through the reaktor, and divert the difference to circulation.

    the 2215 is definitely undegunned for the task. :(

    If you can find a machinist that can accurately machine new fittings for the AM 1000 then your answer is yes, but It will likely cost more than the reaktor itself. :p

    Eheim does however make a splitter for their surface extractor that can divide the flow, but you will need a ball valve at the end of the diverted bye pass to back pressure the bulk of the affluent through the reaktor. :cool: HTH. Prof M

    The 2217 comes very close to the desired flow. The wife had similar problems with hers, but I got her a Pro 3e 2078, and the splitter, and all is well now. Co2 stays extremely stable through the cycle, and circulation and O2 are pretty luxurious at night. ;)

    Edit/Update: After rechecking the output figures for the 2028 I doubt a splitter is even neccessary, just step it down, and run it directly throught the reaktor. There will be light back pressure, but just enough to maintain ambient pressure within the reactor increasing Co2 saturation in a pressurized interface.
     
  8. shane

    shane Lifetime Charter Member
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    Thanks Professor,

    Ya, I was afraid the 2215 wasn't cutting it. The 2217 seems to be a pretty perfect fit. 13 mm output works with the AM1000. The flow is like 50% more than the 2215. It sounds like the 2217 would work perfectly.
     
  9. Professor Myers

    Professor Myers Guru Class Expert

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    2217

    Actually the 2217 was pert near perfect, but any loading of the filter set it back pretty quickly !

    Since you have the 2229 on hand I'd imagine the combination of the 2228/2229 would be fairly bullet proof bye way of overkill. With increased circulation you may burn a bit more Co2 but that's a risk most of us are willing to take. I expect you should see a difference in both the plants and fishes vital appearance within days or certainly within a few weeks. The P.M. o2 cycle is an oversight that many people fall prey to. Plants need the o2 and a restoration cycle every bit as much or more than livestock. Prof M
     
  10. shane

    shane Lifetime Charter Member
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    Well the Eheim 2229 is a wet/dry filter. It creates a wavelike output. The output will be very O2 saturated. I am a bit leary of using it in a planted aquarium. I believe they are normally used on marine aquariums. What do you think?
     
  11. Professor Myers

    Professor Myers Guru Class Expert

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    I beleive the benefit may outway any difference in consumption, but If Your Co2 consumption should shoot through the roof I'd readress the issue at that time.

    We basically accomplished the same thing with the Pro 3e 2078. Flow volume was doubled, and we acheieved a wave surge affect, but were not affected by the same air mixing feature that the 2229 incorporates into the trickle filter design.

    Do you use the Eheim surface extractor ? I've found them to be fairly useful on planted tanks as well.

    I do use trickle filters on my display tanks, but the trickle towers are sealed to prevent Co2 loss, and the spill way is adjusted to 1 1/4" drop.

    I guess you'll never know until you try ? The only projected loss would seem to be Co2, but you may acheive a serendipitous balance of Co2/o2 in the process. Do keep an eye on your PH initially to ere on the side of caution. I do understand your concern, but you may be giving that air mixing feature WAY TOO much credit... :rolleyes: It's a nice feature but I've personally never confirmed the efficiency of the device. I wonder if the air intake could be converted to mix Co2 ? Hmmmmm...Prof M
     
  12. shane

    shane Lifetime Charter Member
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    I think you are right professor. I suppose I can try it. I will need to somehow plumb the AM1000 to accept 17mm inputs/outputs somehow. I think I will ask Aqua Medic if they sell such a piece.

    Thanks....
     
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