Cerges Dwell Time Reactor - Build Video Part 1

Gerryd

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Hey all,

As the title says.......

This will be used for a 75 gal rimless tank and a sump with wet/dry.

I mention using pipe dope (iirc) in the video for the connections to the filter housing, but I will use Teflon tape.

This shows the parts and I do a walk through of the operation.

I will post a new video tomorrow showing more of the actual installation and then operation.

Hope this helps someone.

 
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ltb420

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Very nice, I was always under the impression that water entered the housing then up the center tube and out to the aquarium.
 

shoggoth43

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I believe that was the original way. However, doing it this way ensures that you will not have any extra gases in the top of the unit after it has been operating for some time. The old way would end up with a pocket of gas at the top which sometimes needed to be purged as it could be noisy and impact the operation. Any gas which does not dissolve will just flush out to the sump automatically. If you aim the outflow towards you return pump any remaining mist will be chopped a second time and should be pretty much completely dissolved by the time it hits your display tank.

You could easily swap this around an see which works best for you but not having to purge anything makes for one less thing to do.

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S

ltb420;120338 said:
Very nice, I was always under the impression that water entered the housing then up the center tube and out to the aquarium.
 

devilduck

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Sep 20, 2012
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I guess I just built my cerges reactor using the "old way".
My co2 enters at a hole drilled at the top of the reactor. Do I now run that hose up the center tube? When did the design change?
 
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shoggoth43

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I'm not sure it's a design change as such. Just a different way to do the same thing. The place where the CO2 tube feeds in at the top has always been a leak problem for me so the next time I do some plumbing changes this is on my list.

I think most of the ones that use this style feed it with a needle wheel reactor, or into a pump intake. I don't see why you couldn't run the CO2 tube up the center pipe, but it might just be easier to drill a hole in the top center for a new CO2 inlet. Even simpler would be to just feed it into the intake on the powerhead feeding the reactor. You can then just plug the old CO2 inlet on the reactor.

If your current design is working I'd probably leave it unless/until it's time to make other plumbing changes. Of course if you like to tinker this would be a pretty simple project to play with. You could even use a T fitting and some 45 or 90 degree elbows at the bottom of the center tube to give it a swirling motion in the reactor if you were so inclined. I should look something like this ~ when viewed from the end of the pipe. I'm not sure it will get you much but it may be something to try and wouldn't cost more than a couple of dollars in fittings.

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S

devilduck;120915 said:
I guess I just built my cerges reactor using the "old way".
My co2 enters at a hole drilled at the top of the reactor. Do I now run that hose up the center tube? When did the design change?
 

Tug

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I see a pressure release valve on Gerry's filter - you want that. You can add one. Shut off valves, too - a pressure release valve on the filter or one on the shut-off valve leaving the filter. Really, it's non sequitur. Reversing the flow - brilliant. Tubby, Tabby, Tube, dwell, del twine, dwell, dwell time, dwell, baby, bam-balam, bam. Surface flow you could watch all day, Oxygen for the tanks BOD, flow out of the sump w/CO2, fewer bubbles, well, no bubbles - the tank looks fat, G!

Out the In. :stupid::teapot:
Easy! :pirate:
 
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Gerryd

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rbarn;121198 said:
Instead of vinyl tubing on the inlet and outlet I highly recommend using FlexPVC's "no kink pond hose"
It is more flexible than braided vinyl tubing, can not collapse or kink and has a smooth inner surface for barb fittings.

Definitely worth the extra money in the long run. Comes in everything from 1/2" to 6"
http://flexpvc.com/cart/agora.cgi?cart_id=96806056.10728&product=Black-No-Kink-PondFlexBTF

This looks like good stuff. I am going to nab some and see how I like it.

Thanks for the link!

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devilduck;120915 said:
I guess I just built my cerges reactor using the "old way".
My co2 enters at a hole drilled at the top of the reactor. Do I now run that hose up the center tube? When did the design change?

A cerges is different from a normal reactor. The cerges CAN be used as a reactor by inserting the c02 into the cerges directly, rather than use the discharge from a NW....

The reactor design has not changed :)
 

Tom Barr

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Note, you can easily modify the cerges reactor to be a dual stage venturi like the article:

http://www.barrreport.com/showthread.php/3444-Dual-venturi-DIY-External-CO2-reactor

This yields the best of both worlds, giving you a purge effect if the reactor fills with either air or too much CO2, and 100% mist free operation otherwise.
By setting the second 3/16" rigid tubing depth say at 1/2 the depth of the reactor, the venturi and thus misting effect will NOT occur until the gas build up reaches that point, so you have little or no mist of any sort.
The 1st 3/16th rigid tuvvign is your bubble counter and your CO2 input. The venturi line is used ONLY when there's excess gas build up inside the reactor.

You can also add bioballs etc, inside the break the water up some more, mix better and trap more microbubbles etc.
This way your tank does not look like 7UP and if the CO2 mist does occur, it only happens for a maybe 2-3 hours in the latter part of the day.
This is quieter, less haze inside the aquarium.

For most users, switching over to this method should not require any real adjustment for the CO2 and likely would stabilize the CO2 for a more mesa like shape.
This is because once the venturi kicks in after the build up, the CO2 is atomized and by passes the reactor and is degassed. So less build up of gas.
It also reduces noise if you use the return pump for the venturi, I have always tried to use just the Needle wheel specific powerhead inside the sump as this seems to work better and produces less mist, but I will likely switch the reactors all over to this method as some point.
So instead of the PVC and clear PVC builds, you use a clear water filter, or.............you make a nice custom clear PVC etc reactor your self.
 

reef12

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A monster it is.

My Chinese CO 2 diffuser seems to be doing okay, a mist , not a real fine mist , but hey I could buy 10 for the price of one Beetle 50.:joyous:

Jeff
 

jerrybforl

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Tom Barr;123114 said:
Note, you can easily modify the cerges reactor to be a dual stage venturi like the article:

http://www.barrreport.com/showthread.php/3444-Dual-venturi-DIY-External-CO2-reactor

This yields the best of both worlds, giving you a purge effect if the reactor fills with either air or too much CO2, and 100% mist free operation otherwise.
By setting the second 3/16" rigid tubing depth say at 1/2 the depth of the reactor, the venturi and thus misting effect will NOT occur until the gas build up reaches that point, so you have little or no mist of any sort.
The 1st 3/16th rigid tuvvign is your bubble counter and your CO2 input. The venturi line is used ONLY when there's excess gas build up inside the reactor.

You can also add bioballs etc, inside the break the water up some more, mix better and trap more microbubbles etc.
This way your tank does not look like 7UP and if the CO2 mist does occur, it only happens for a maybe 2-3 hours in the latter part of the day.
This is quieter, less haze inside the aquarium.

For most users, switching over to this method should not require any real adjustment for the CO2 and likely would stabilize the CO2 for a more mesa like shape.
This is because once the venturi kicks in after the build up, the CO2 is atomized and by passes the reactor and is degassed. So less build up of gas.
It also reduces noise if you use the return pump for the venturi, I have always tried to use just the Needle wheel specific powerhead inside the sump as this seems to work better and produces less mist, but I will likely switch the reactors all over to this method as some point.
So instead of the PVC and clear PVC builds, you use a clear water filter, or.............you make a nice custom clear PVC etc reactor your self.

Tom that thread is so long lol. Could you please explain how you use a cerges as a dual venturi? I got lost a bit. I summary would be awesome.

I have a aquariumplants.com cerges that I bought few years ago. It has the CO2 insert on top. Will this still work ok? It also has a small pump in the bottom of it. Not really sure what it's for. I will switch the flow around like Gerry suggested.

- - - Updated - - -

Tom Barr;123114 said:
Note, you can easily modify the cerges reactor to be a dual stage venturi like the article:

http://www.barrreport.com/showthread.php/3444-Dual-venturi-DIY-External-CO2-reactor

This yields the best of both worlds, giving you a purge effect if the reactor fills with either air or too much CO2, and 100% mist free operation otherwise.
By setting the second 3/16" rigid tubing depth say at 1/2 the depth of the reactor, the venturi and thus misting effect will NOT occur until the gas build up reaches that point, so you have little or no mist of any sort.
The 1st 3/16th rigid tuvvign is your bubble counter and your CO2 input. The venturi line is used ONLY when there's excess gas build up inside the reactor.

You can also add bioballs etc, inside the break the water up some more, mix better and trap more microbubbles etc.
This way your tank does not look like 7UP and if the CO2 mist does occur, it only happens for a maybe 2-3 hours in the latter part of the day.
This is quieter, less haze inside the aquarium.

For most users, switching over to this method should not require any real adjustment for the CO2 and likely would stabilize the CO2 for a more mesa like shape.
This is because once the venturi kicks in after the build up, the CO2 is atomized and by passes the reactor and is degassed. So less build up of gas.
It also reduces noise if you use the return pump for the venturi, I have always tried to use just the Needle wheel specific powerhead inside the sump as this seems to work better and produces less mist, but I will likely switch the reactors all over to this method as some point.
So instead of the PVC and clear PVC builds, you use a clear water filter, or.............you make a nice custom clear PVC etc reactor your self.

Tom that thread is so long lol. Could you please explain how you use a cerges as a dual venturi? I got lost a bit. I summary would be awesome.

I have a aquariumplants.com cerges that I bought few years ago. It has the CO2 insert on top. Will this still work ok? It also has a small pump in the bottom of it. Not really sure what it's for. I will switch the flow around like Gerry suggested.
 

Gerryd

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jerrybforl;123137 said:
Tom that thread is so long lol. Could you please explain how you use a cerges as a dual venturi? I got lost a bit. I summary would be awesome.

I have a aquariumplants.com cerges that I bought few years ago. It has the CO2 insert on top. Will this still work ok? It also has a small pump in the bottom of it. Not really sure what it's for. I will switch the flow around like Gerry suggested.
.

Hey JJ,

First, there is a difference between a normal c02 'reactor' and my dwell time unit I call a 'cerges'. A reactor (to me) is fed directly with c02 and the water flow mixes the c02. There may or may not be bio-balls or such in the housing. A dwell time unit is fed c02 enriched water (usually from a nw pump) and the unit simply removes much of the mist that is input to it.

A dwell time unit can be drilled thru the top to feed both a c02 intake as well as a venture. The reactor is now simply the water filter housing instead of building one with pvc. The housing is clear and usually bigger and no need to build one. The inlet/outlet is simply side to side instead of top to bottom. You then use it as a normal 'reactor'.

In the big thread, the key post is upfront where he shows drilling thru the one end (the top) to insert the rigid tubing for c02 and the venture. Just not sure how hard it is to drill thru the water filter housings.

My unit is only meant to remove mist from the mist from the needle wheel output.

Does this make sense?

- - - Updated - - -

jerrybforl;123137 said:
Tom that thread is so long lol. Could you please explain how you use a cerges as a dual venturi? I got lost a bit. I summary would be awesome.

I have a aquariumplants.com cerges that I bought few years ago. It has the CO2 insert on top. Will this still work ok? It also has a small pump in the bottom of it. Not really sure what it's for. I will switch the flow around like Gerry suggested.
.

Hey JJ,

First, there is a difference between a normal c02 'reactor' and my dwell time unit I call a 'cerges'. A reactor (to me) is fed directly with c02 and the water flow mixes the c02. There may or may not be bio-balls or such in the housing. A dwell time unit is fed c02 enriched water (usually from a nw pump) and the unit simply removes much of the mist that is input to it.

A dwell time unit can be drilled thru the top to feed both a c02 intake as well as a venture. The reactor is now simply the water filter housing instead of building one with pvc. The housing is clear and usually bigger and no need to build one. The inlet/outlet is simply side to side instead of top to bottom. You then use it as a normal 'reactor'.

In the big thread, the key post is upfront where he shows drilling thru the one end (the top) to insert the rigid tubing for c02 and the venture. Just not sure how hard it is to drill thru the water filter housings.

My unit is only meant to remove mist from the mist from the needle wheel output.

Does this make sense?
 

Tug

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Gerry, what size NW are you using and could you explain how to determine the correct pump flow rate?
 

Gerryd

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Hey,

I use either a rio 1000 or 1100 model, approx. 271 to 350 gph based on model. Very low flow. I use the green eheim 5/8 tubing all around, so this restricts flow further. I also use 2-3 feet of tubing on either side to add even more time before it hits the sump. The smaller tanks have smaller cerges units and lower bubble rates, but they all seem to work great this way.

I am thinking of going to 1" tubing on the 220 larger unit and install a second on the other outlet. Will have higher flow then obviously, but will with 2 of them, I should be okay. I can always easily revert.

I can't splain HOW to size, but I think for a dwell time, you want LONGER time in the units, so LESS flow is better IME.

Does this make sense? If a true reactor you WOULD want large tubing and more flow.

I will post some vids later and they may help.
 
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