Calcium Carbonate

dannyfish

Prolific Poster
Jan 6, 2010
40
0
6
Singapore
Hi all

Need some advise here..

i have dose some Calcium Carbonate into my tank and the tank become very cloudy...

is it normal?

Any method to dose Calcium Carbonate without making the tank so cloudy?

Thk
 

nipat

Guru Class Expert
May 23, 2009
665
0
16
dannyfish;54098 said:
Hi all

Need some advise here..

i have dose some Calcium Carbonate into my tank and the tank become very cloudy...

is it normal?

Any method to dose Calcium Carbonate without making the tank so cloudy?

Thk

What form of CaCO3 you're using?
I had used it in chip form, not powder.
No clouding. :)
 

dannyfish

Prolific Poster
Jan 6, 2010
40
0
6
Singapore
nipat;54105 said:
What form of CaCO3 you're using?
I had used it in chip form, not powder.
No clouding. :)

I using powder form.
I just bought a bottle of it so cannot change to chip form.

Any idea how to dose in powder form?
 

nipat

Guru Class Expert
May 23, 2009
665
0
16
After rethinking, CaCO3 raises KH and GH.

High KH have been said to cloud water when adding iron fert or when using ADA Aqua Soil
(but it seems Tom don't believe the latter). But I've never had high KH, that may explain why
I've never had the issue. So I'm afraid I don't have a suggestion.

These links may be useful.
http://www.aquajournal.net/na/notes/001/index.html
http://www.barrreport.com/showthrea...s-between-ADA-soils-(Africana-Malaya-Amazonia)
http://www.barrreport.com/showthread.php/6455-Iron-clouding-the-water?p=44378
 

Biollante

Lifetime Charter Member
Lifetime Member
Jun 21, 2009
3,210
2
36
Surprise, AZ
It Don't Wanna Dissolve

Hi,

Calcium carbonate, CaCO3, simply is not very soluble in water. It is why most folks prefer, gypsum, Calcium sulphate CaSO4 or plaster of Paris, 2CaSO4.H2O that even though slow dissolving it is many times quicker than Calcium carbonate. :gw


Nipat’s rethink is a good one as Calcium carbonate raises GH and KH in equal measure. :)


Calcium sulphate will not raise carbonate hardness (in freshwater aquarium ranges anyway), alkalinity.

I have never used ADA Aqua Soil (or any other commercial substrate for that matter) so I cannot speak to ADA Aqua Soil causing cloudiness in high KH water. My experience with water cloudiness related to substrates is that it is usually associated with very light material producing very small particles. :)


I do use Plantex CSM+B, chelated iron 10 & 13% ETDA as well as 13% DPTA and I have not noted any cloudiness attributable to the iron or chelating agents in tanks with KH ranging from less than 1dKH to over 15dKH

I think you could run a variation of the demonstration I recommend http://www.barrreport.com/showthrea...m-Flourish-Iron)?p=54021&highlight=#post54021 here to see if chelated iron clouds water at a particular KH.

Biollante
 

j_mc

Junior Poster
Jun 15, 2010
1
0
1
Biollante;54132 said:
I do use Plantex CSM+B, chelated iron 10 & 13% ETDA as well as 13% DPTA and I have not noted any cloudiness attributable to the iron or chelating agents in tanks with KH ranging from less than 1dKH to over 15dKH



Biollante

Why do you dose 3 types of chelated iron? I'm just rounding up ingredients for my own DIY fertiliser regime and am curious as to why. :)
 

Biollante

Lifetime Charter Member
Lifetime Member
Jun 21, 2009
3,210
2
36
Surprise, AZ
ETDA, DPTA, Who Knew?

j_mc;54720 said:
Why do you dose 3 types of chelated iron? I'm just rounding up ingredients for my own DIY fertiliser regime and am curious as to why. :)

Hi,

I have been using the different types of iron chelators to see what happens. There had had been a lot of talk about precipitates and how long the iron remained effective with various types of chelators. I also tried iron gluconate.

So now, I have a bunch of 10 & 13% ETDA and 13% DPTA. I generally add iron to CSM+B something like one part iron to three, four or five parts CSM+B. :confused: Sometimes I just dose iron separately. :)

I find either ETDA or DPTA iron chelators work well. If you have higher KH then the DPTA is probably the better choice. I cannot say I have noticed a difference, though I am a Nutrient Type, :eek: so it may just be that I keep the levels so high that it make no difference. :D

Biollante
 

cannibal

Prolific Poster
Nov 18, 2009
32
0
6
42
croatia
Question...
Why adding CaSO4 to aquarium? Please, I don't know, that's why I'm asking..Thanks for answering
Dario
 

dannyfish

Prolific Poster
Jan 6, 2010
40
0
6
Singapore
Biollante;54723 said:
Hi,

I have been using the different types of iron chelators to see what happens. There had had been a lot of talk about precipitates and how long the iron remained effective with various types of chelators. I also tried iron gluconate.

So now, I have a bunch of 10 & 13% ETDA and 13% DPTA. I generally add iron to CSM+B something like one part iron to three, four or five parts CSM+B. :confused: Sometimes I just dose iron separately. :)

I find either ETDA or DPTA iron chelators work well. If you have higher KH then the DPTA is probably the better choice. I cannot say I have noticed a difference, though I am a Nutrient Type, :eek: so it may just be that I keep the levels so high that it make no difference. :D

Biollante

Hi
May I know will high dose of iron will make the tank water cloudy???
 

Biollante

Lifetime Charter Member
Lifetime Member
Jun 21, 2009
3,210
2
36
Surprise, AZ
Not That I Have Seen

Hi,

I am reluctant to say iron will not cause cloudiness, simply because so many have said it does. :confused:

My experience that includes trying combinations is chelated iron does not cause cloudiness, certainly nothing in the 0.5-2ppm range that most aquarists use. :)

Perhaps above 12-dKH and over 10-ppm Fe 2 EDTA, it is possible I have seen some short duration cloudiness though I am not sure. Likewise, I have seen short-term cloudiness when using a Seachem product in high alkaline water that seemed to briefly cloud, almost smoke-like. However, that was before I was really paying attention to the precipitate. :eek:

Biollante
 

Biollante

Lifetime Charter Member
Lifetime Member
Jun 21, 2009
3,210
2
36
Surprise, AZ
Calcium!

cannibal;54729 said:
Question...
Why adding CaSO4 to aquarium? Please, I don't know, that's why I'm asking..Thanks for answering
Dario

Hi Dario,

We add Calcium to raise the general hardness. Calcium is important for the health and well-being of our plants and critters. :gw

Calcium sulfate, CaSO4 is popular because it is cheap and readily available. :cool:

Biollante
 

dannyfish

Prolific Poster
Jan 6, 2010
40
0
6
Singapore
Biollante;54757 said:
Hi,

I am reluctant to say iron will not cause cloudiness, simply because so many have said it does. :confused:

My experience that includes trying combinations is chelated iron does not cause cloudiness, certainly nothing in the 0.5-2ppm range that most aquarists use. :)

Perhaps above 12-dKH and over 10-ppm Fe 2 EDTA, it is possible I have seen some short duration cloudiness though I am not sure. Likewise, I have seen short-term cloudiness when using a Seachem product in high alkaline water that seemed to briefly cloud, almost smoke-like. However, that was before I was really paying attention to the precipitate. :eek:

Biollante


I using ferrous gluconate

But then I not very sure on the amount to use for my 55 liters tank. So I use 1tsp mixed with 250ml water and dose 5ml into my tank alternate day.

Water get cloudy soon after ....

May I know the correct dry dosing amount if I using ferrous gluconate in 55litres tank??
 

nipat

Guru Class Expert
May 23, 2009
665
0
16
dannyfish;54763 said:
I using ferrous gluconate

But then I not very sure on the amount to use for my 55 liters tank. So I use 1tsp mixed with 250ml water and dose 5ml into my tank alternate day.

Water get cloudy soon after ....

May I know the correct dry dosing amount if I using ferrous gluconate in 55litres tank??

If I remember it right, gluconate is weaker than EDTA. So it may be the cause of
your problem (apart from KH from CaCO3). I've never used it though.

Do you need to increase KH?
 

dannyfish

Prolific Poster
Jan 6, 2010
40
0
6
Singapore
nipat;54764 said:
If I remember it right, gluconate is weaker than EDTA. So it may be the cause of
your problem (apart from KH from CaCO3). I've never used it though.

Do you need to increase KH?

Don't think i need to increase KH...
 

nipat

Guru Class Expert
May 23, 2009
665
0
16
So I think you better use CaSO4 (Calcium Sulphate) for calcium instead.
 

Biollante

Lifetime Charter Member
Lifetime Member
Jun 21, 2009
3,210
2
36
Surprise, AZ
Nipat As Usual Is Correct & Apologies to Jonny

Hi,

Nipat, as usual, remembers correctly! Iron gluconate does indeed break down more quickly than the other iron chelates. In return, the iron is supposed to be more usable. ;)

I certainly would not wish to raise the carbonate hardness were I using iron gluconate. :)

Then I do not know anything about your alkalinity, so it is hard to say. :confused:

For all I know your alkalinity could be 0dKH, few aside from our friend Jonny would find that acceptable.
The iron gluconate would I assume be most effective. Same goes if you are raising certain plants that like 2-4dKH, again the iron gluconate would seem an excellent choice.
Once we emerge into what I consider the stable, “normal” ranges of alkalinity, 5-8dKH I think the iron gluconate is perhaps not as effective and iron complexed with ETDA or DPTA.
Most seem to agree that with alkalinity above 10dKH, DPTA seems most effective. :)

Biollante
 

cannibal

Prolific Poster
Nov 18, 2009
32
0
6
42
croatia
Biollante;54758 said:
Hi Dario,

We add Calcium to raise the general hardness. Calcium is important for the health and well-being of our plants and critters. :gw

Calcium sulfate, CaSO4 is popular because it is cheap and readily available. :cool:

Biollante

That I know before, I have Malawi Cichlids with high carbonate hardness 20 I think..In Croatia water that we drink have a high carbonate hardness, I messured 19,9..
I ask you why, because I'm think you use CaSO4 for fertilize plants :D Don't laugh
Dario
 

Biollante

Lifetime Charter Member
Lifetime Member
Jun 21, 2009
3,210
2
36
Surprise, AZ
KH GH Who Knew

Hi Dario,

Carbonate hardness is alkalinity, KH, the buffering capacity of the water 20dKH is quite high but manageable. At that alkalinity, I think you need to dose iron chelated with DPTA; my guess is that the gluconate is not doing any good. :gw

Calcium sulfate, CaSO4 will add to the general hardness, GH.

I like to see GH above 4dGH I prefer 6-8dGH. If it is low adding Calcium and Epsom salts, MgSO4.7H2O raises the GH. :)

Biollante
 

Oreo

Guru Class Expert
May 6, 2010
251
0
16
If I keep my water below 32*F will that increase my water's hardness?

;)