Bad mix: green water + brown algae

_ReApEr

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LOL, I agree I could be more patient. It's just that it's plagued me for a year, now, and it's attacking what I thought was going to turn out to be beautiful growth. That's why I did a small section, though, so I can experiment and get the algae under control before moving on to the rest of the tank. I'll give it time, we'll see how it goes over the next month or so.

As far as the lighting, technically, I could run as low as 24w at a time with that fixture. I was thinking something like 48 watts at a time, alternating bulbs since it has two plugs, maybe for 5 hours each with an overlap for 96w for an hour midday.
 

Philosophos

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48 from two sources alternating would offer you about the same light as 65w but with better spread; far better depending on how you set things up. You could experiment with a full 96w burst and see what happens.

Personally I don't think your tank shows enough density to require more intense light right now, but better spread and varying the angle of light is always good, and should always come before intensity IMO. Experimenting what's already been done is part of learning; I spent plenty of time pushing parameters beyond what everyone else told me just to prove it to my self.

Now you're speaking of brown algae, but all I'm seeing is what might be BBA along the edges. Any chance of getting a shot of this brown algae? I normally wouldn't ask, but you seem to not mind taking pictures of your tank.

-Philosophos
 

_ReApEr

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I don't know how your reply slipped by me, Philosophos, but I'm sorry I missed it. Regarding the lights, that's just the thing: I do plan on getting it more densely planted and definitely adding a carpet of some sort. I'm just going to have to buy some HC, I guess, and see how it does. Any recommendations on where to get it?

For the algae, here are a couple pictures.

This one is of the brand new Bacopa that I trimmed and replanted last week. It was perfectly clean when I did it, it obviously isn't anymore. It's kind of brown-red-orange in color and it's filmy. You can see that it's fairly thick in some areas, some leaves are already totally covered.
algae.png


This is what it eventually progresses to. Obviously a little thicker, but the same general color. It's not, however, filmy at this stage, it's more of a crust that can be quite difficult to scrape off.
algae2.png


Thanks for all your help, I truly appreciate it.
 

Gerryd

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Hi,

I stick with my original diagnosis of too much light and insufficient c02. Your recent pics support my hypothesis :)

If it has been over 1 year, a few more weeks shouldn't be an issue lol
 

Philosophos

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I'd agree with not enough CO2. You're running a reactor, which isn't going to do so well as a needle wheel. It's also harder to see where your CO2 is distributing to with one of these.

I think the most obvious thing looking at that picture is your rain bar configuration. I wasn't paying close attention to it earlier. Angle all of the segments downwards, perhaps a couple aimed almost straight down into the bacopa and some angled more towards the sword.

It's no wonder your drop checker is yellow, but your plants are low CO2, and your fish aren't stressed. Much of your CO2 is being aimed practically out of the tank rather than into the plants.

Watch your tank closely, I have a feeling the decreased surface disturbance and better CO2 distribution is going to cause much higher saturation levels at the same bubble rate. You may have to turn your CO2 down.

As for HC, look around the trading sections of forums if you want it cheap; it's all over the place, and lots of people supply pictures. Aquariumplants.com is where I got mine with a big order of plants. They have very high quality plants, but they're anal about shipping. The rock wool they use to root it can have mixed results; I'd recommend spacing the plugs out well to make sure that it's rooting to the substrate and not floating anchored. Still, it beats sprinkling substrate over HC and the price is reasonable.

-Philosophos
 

_ReApEr

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Philosophos;42809 said:
I'd agree with not enough CO2. You're running a reactor, which isn't going to do so well as a needle wheel. It's also harder to see where your CO2 is distributing to with one of these.
Okay, you've finally convinced me to consider a needle wheel. My main concern is just how conspicuous it is. A 29g isn't that big, so anything in the tank does detract from the overall aesthetic. I guess I haven't looked into them so much, though, so I don't really know how conspicuous they are. I'll do that.

Philosophos;42809 said:
I think the most obvious thing looking at that picture is your rain bar configuration. I wasn't paying close attention to it earlier. Angle all of the segments downwards, perhaps a couple aimed almost straight down into the bacopa and some angled more towards the sword.
It's configured like this:
[---out/down---][-straight down-][---no holes----][-------up------][---out/down---]

The one pointing up was because I was under the influence that surface movement was important. I'll try this one:

[---out/down---][-straight down-][---no holes----][-straight down-][---out/down---]

Think that'd be better? Also, Santa will be bringing me a Koralia Nano or two, so that should help when that comes around.

Philosophos;42809 said:
It's no wonder your drop checker is yellow, but your plants are low CO2, and your fish aren't stressed. Much of your CO2 is being aimed practically out of the tank rather than into the plants.
Shouldn't that also mean the drop checker doesn't register the CO2, though?

Philosophos;42809 said:
Watch your tank closely, I have a feeling the decreased surface disturbance and better CO2 distribution is going to cause much higher saturation levels at the same bubble rate. You may have to turn your CO2 down.
I'll try the above configuration and see what happens. I'll keep a close eye.

Philosophos;42809 said:
As for HC, look around the trading sections of forums if you want it cheap; it's all over the place, and lots of people supply pictures. Aquariumplants.com is where I got mine with a big order of plants. They have very high quality plants, but they're anal about shipping. The rock wool they use to root it can have mixed results; I'd recommend spacing the plugs out well to make sure that it's rooting to the substrate and not floating anchored. Still, it beats sprinkling substrate over HC and the price is reasonable.
Alrighty, I'll check around.

Thanks again, both of you, super appreciated.

EDIT: Decided to go with this:
[---out/down---][-straight down-][---no holes----][---out/down---][-straight down-]

So it sprays, left to right, in this order: right over and into two swords, directly into a Bacopa bunch, towards the bottom/front of the tank for some crypt lovin', and straight into another bunch of Bacopa.
 

Philosophos

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_ReApEr;42810 said:
Okay, you've finally convinced me to consider a needle wheel. My main concern is just how conspicuous it is. A 29g isn't that big, so anything in the tank does detract from the overall aesthetic. I guess I haven't looked into them so much, though, so I don't really know how conspicuous they are. I'll do that.
Wait and see if your new spray bar configuration works first. If it doesn't work so well, you could probably hide a powerhead behind some hardscape and angle the powerhead so that it blows across the current from the rain bar.

The one pointing up was because I was under the influence that surface movement was important. I'll try this one:

[---out/down---][-straight down-][---no holes----][-straight down-][---out/down---]

Think that'd be better? Also, Santa will be bringing me a Koralia Nano or two, so that should help when that comes around.
Surface disturbance is nice; I have a small powerhead at the top of my tank just for that purpose. It's not mandatory though, especially if you set things up to blow a little air in at night.


Shouldn't that also mean the drop checker doesn't register the CO2, though?
Possibly not with how some of it was set to blow across the surface; the upper level of your tank may have had a far higher saturation than down low.

-Philosophos
 

_ReApEr

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Philosophos;42818 said:
Wait and see if your new spray bar configuration works first. If it doesn't work so well, you could probably hide a powerhead behind some hardscape and angle the powerhead so that it blows across the current from the rain bar.
I don't think there's room to hide anything behind that piece of wood, so I'm just going to hope, for now, that the spray bar change does some good.

Philosophos;42818 said:
Surface disturbance is nice; I have a small powerhead at the top of my tank just for that purpose. It's not mandatory though, especially if you set things up to blow a little air in at night.
I do have an airstone that kicks on when the lights/CO2 shut off and then turn back off when the lights/CO2 turn on.

Philosophos;42818 said:
Possibly not with how some of it was set to blow across the surface; the upper level of your tank may have had a far higher saturation than down low.
I have been moving my drop checker around, so far at four positions: front/top/left, front/top/right, back/bottom/left/, back/middle/middle. So far, they've all shown the same results: yellow. We've already established, though, that the drop checker may be misleading, so I'm just going to hope the spray bar configuration does work. If not, I'll have to look into needle wheels. We'll have to see.
 

_ReApEr

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So, after the first day with the new configuration, the fish showed no signs of stress whatsoever. I am getting better circulation, no doubt there. There was more evenly spread pearling going on today. But I'm also getting surface scum again. We'll see if the bubbles break that up overnight, which would be nice.

Also, looking into needle wheels, there are options to do it externally, so I'll look into that a bit more. Or, perhaps, just use a small powerhead like a Rio600 with holes melted in the impeller. I have to look a little deeper into my options still.

Also, upon further investigation, I think I can fairly confidently say it's not BBA that's plaguing me. It never develops "tufts," it just moves from a film to a crust over the course of a few months. Like I said, I've had issues with it since I set the tank up a year ago, and have never seen a single "tuft," just film and crust.
 

_ReApEr

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So, since the fish seemed to ignore the lack of surface movement, I figured I'd turn my CO2 up. So I did, just a hair. And now, at the end of the photo period, I have a couple at the surface. So, back down it goes. I'm now at my limit for CO2 content. Obviously, that could still be due to circulation.

In other news, with any luck with the weather, I should be getting some HC, hair grass, and micro sword compliments of MONARK over at APE, so that should at least help me determine whether or not I have sufficient lighting for the HC carpet I want as well as some experimentation with other plants. Yes, I know that a lack of CO2 circulation could still inhibit their growth, so I won't downright say if they don't make it that I need to upgrade lights. It'll just help me make that choice.

In other news, I have a question about my CO2 reactor. With this current setup (just a Rex Grigg style reactor inline with my Eheim 2026), I get a lot of gas buildup in the reactor. If I were to drill a hole in the top and insert tubing that went to, say, the back of a Koralia Nano, would it have enough suction to suck out the excess gas? Or would I have to connect it to a venturi? I thought about the possibility of getting a Rio600 just for the sake of preventing this gas buildup. However, again, I am a huge fan of having as little equipment in the tank as possible and I already plan on adding a Koralia Nano for circulation, so if that could double as a gas-buildup-killer, all the better. Thoughts?

Thanks!
 

shoggoth43

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I don't know that the Koralia Nano would have much suction. However, the TAAM units are similar and do actually have an intake port for this purpose but again, I don't know how much suction they have either. Give the reactor is probably under pressure you may not need all that much suction, if any at all. It's probably worth a couple minutes time to try it out on the Koralia if you already own that though.

-
S

_ReApEr;42865 said:
...
In other news, I have a question about my CO2 reactor. With this current setup (just a Rex Grigg style reactor inline with my Eheim 2026), I get a lot of gas buildup in the reactor. If I were to drill a hole in the top and insert tubing that went to, say, the back of a Koralia Nano, would it have enough suction to suck out the excess gas? Or would I have to connect it to a venturi? I thought about the possibility of getting a Rio600 just for the sake of preventing this gas buildup. However, again, I am a huge fan of having as little equipment in the tank as possible and I already plan on adding a Koralia Nano for circulation, so if that could double as a gas-buildup-killer, all the better. Thoughts?

Thanks!