Are breed colored discus preferred over the wild strains?

Can't argue that point...

Because I agree. Many years ago I lusted after Cobalt Blues. I still enjoy Degen's Red Cobalts for their contrast, but I just can't say they are actually more attractive than great big ole Tefes, a nice Heckle, or truth be known...a grip of robust Altum Angels. The first fish I fell in love with as a boy were the Altums down at Pasquale's Pizzaria. These days they may very well be my last Tango ! The wife's been seeing a trio of German Cobalts on the sly...Women ???

 

I would not put physically painted glass fish and genetically engineered GFP danios in the same category as artificially selected but still coming from natural gene pools breeds.

Moreover, "nature aquarium" concept coined by Amano and ADA, in my opinion, is a direct projection of traditional Japanese gardening into the glass confines of an aquarium. And to quote Japan National Tourist Organization: "The classic Japanese garden is an artificial garden that reproduces natural scenic beauty in a heightened intensity."

To achieve that "heightened intensity" we do use types of hardscape never found in natural waters, all sorts of not truly aquatic plants, cultivar plants, species of fish from different biotopes, etc.

So I guess it is a fair game to use breeds. As long as they look natural enough. In case of discuss, in my opinion, some breeds do not quite make it.

Regards.

Vladimir.

 

Tom,

Thanks for having me over, you had some nice rock collection going there. My favorite wood was the miniature tree you had at your side yard.

David

 

Does that also apply to plants that have been selectively bred or hybridized to achieve certain characteristics? They look natural.

In my opinion there is nothing "natural" looking about a Japanese garden, any more than there is to my landscaped front yard. Nicely colored koi or goldfish enhance the garden by providing contrast and movement.

Bill

 

not trying to replicate nature

I think bred lines of discus or even the glo-danios are fine. The point for most of us is not to replicate nature, but rather to create something similar to nature, but more attractive than nature. Obviously, which particular discus a person likes depends on a particular person's aestethic sense. Besides, with rare exception, none of us would know what "natural" discus or other tropical fish looked like, except by seeing them in books or aquariums. So, really, if your only opposition to an unnatural fish is that it looks unnatural, you're really saying it doesn't look like what you're used to seeing in certain unnatural settings.

As for "painted" fish, I think physically dyeing a fish is cruel and I try to avoid stores that sell them.

 

Well Tom, you have your opinions and you are entitled to them, they can't really be called "wrong"

It's true that none of these fish are achieved in a natural way, but they vary from nature in different ways, and to me the methods is which they vary makes them acceptable or unacceptable.
Injecting them with an artificail dye that causes cancer in the fish is an abomination, and shouldn't be allowed. I bought some for my kids before I became better educated. Will never do again.
Crossing 2 fish that would not normally do so an achieveing a "blood parrot" is quesionable, and a fish I will not own. From what I have read, these fish are malformed, and some are unable to eat properly. IMO..also an abomination.
I am not familiar with the "glow in the dark" Zebras. If it's injected dye...you now know my opinion on that.

Now...I have just acquired some blue diamond discus. This is my first attempt at discus, and they were offered to me at a great price. I'm deriving from the dicsussion here that they must be selectively bred for the color, much as dogs are bred to fix "desired" traits. I was not aware of this when I got them.
IMO...selective breeding is different that the examples of the dyed fish and the parrots, but still not "natural.

Of course...natural would mean no stocking tanks with any captive bred fish, right? Does that include only using plants that are harvested from the wild?

A lot of fish and plants in the hobby are bred/raised in fellow hobbist's tanks. You will have selective breeding because the gene pool is limited in the "captive" envrionment. Breeding the same stock, and the offspring of that stock ends up with the same results as breeding a discus for a certain color..fixing the traits of that stock.
Just my thoughts....

Personally...I'm not driven enough to be that picky. My goal is healthy fish and a tank that is pleasing in appearance

"wild cows of Iowa"....ROFLOL...haven't met any up close eh?

 

I don't see this as a cut and dried issue...at least not as this 'stage" of my development.

If your intention is to have a natural tank...then you should research what is needed, and have the correct plants and fish. I'd even go so far as to say you should have the correct plants together with the correct fish, as in a biotope tank. How natural is tp have plants from Africa growing next to plants from Asia? Or Austrailian fish in with North American plants? Malaysisan driftwood in with African cichlids?

But as to what is right?? I can't say that. Someone who has clown loaches swimming with boesemani rainbows shouldn't be throwing stones
When I started keeping planted tanks, my intention was to keep a biotope tank. I have drifted from that based on what I found pleasing and what was available to me in the area. I am at the point that I view plants as to what plant contrasts with another, and will look good next to each other with view to color and leaf type, and what fishes provide a variety of colors.

I've got to say, I find the blue diamonds interesting. The color change they do is facinating to me. They go from black to blend in with the background, to an almost electric blue when they are happy, to a pale whitish blue when startled or stressed. I hope someday to go to a bigger discus tank with other varieties. but I don't see myself as wanting a wild fish taken out of it's enviroment. There are plenty of captive bred ones around.

 

Hi,

Here is a good link for those who wonder what a "natural" discus should look like.

Diskus Wildfänge

No high fin Blue Diamond nor perfectly round Pigeon Blood could be found in nature because if such strains exist; they would first to be eaten by piranhas. Those names were just the general locations where these fishes were found.

David

 

Here is a pic of a couple of my Discus, this is my mated pair of Sunshine Discus and Snakeskin on the left.


These guys add such vibrant color to the tank, especially contrasting against the live plants. They also have never changed color even when stressed. I do have a couple wild Discus as well and they will turn a dull yellow/pale color when stressed.

Lee