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Anyone raised Swords from seedlings?

Discussion in 'General Plant Topics' started by Detritus Mulm, Jan 24, 2010.

  1. Detritus Mulm

    Detritus Mulm Guru Class Expert

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    I've got a thousand or so floating around the small planted tank and was thinking of experimenting with them. I normally feed them to the GF (GoldFish for Biollante), but that's rather dull. ;) I've got a 300 gallon bucket and a 1000W Hallide if I want to get crazy. But I'd rather not get as far as requiring gravel for them; how long can I leave them floating around and still expect decent growth?
     
  2. Biollante

    Biollante Lifetime Charter Member
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    Hydroponics

    Hi,

    Yes, I have and do raise Echinodorus ‘Ozelot’ from seed, since they are self-pollinating it is quite simple. :)
    The technique these folks describe is similar to what I do, http://www.thegreenaquarium.com/articles/E_ozelot_001.shtml.

    I use those seed starter trays as you would use for starting plants for the garden before the frost danger is over. I use a rich soil keep it quite most, almost wet. I keep the tray covered, keeping the humidity up is the only trick. Echinodorus spp. grows readily out of the water, rich moist soil and high humidity is the key. :gw

    Light does not seem to be much of an issue, they grow will rather low light. ;)

    You need to put that 1000-watt light to work growing veggies and such hydroponically, you could supply a small town. :eek:

    Biollante
     
  3. shoggoth43

    shoggoth43 Lifetime Charter Member
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    I've got several plantlets I haven't bothered rooting into anything. They've been floating around for several weeks now and seem to be growing just fine.

    I tried a while back to get one of them to grow emmersed but didn't control humidity and thus condemned the poor thing to a shriveled, crispy death. :(

    I'm curious as to your definitions however....

    If 300 gallons is a "bucket", what size is your "tank"? :D

    -
    S
     
  4. Detritus Mulm

    Detritus Mulm Guru Class Expert

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    Thanks, KISS is always better. I'll have to find another excuse to fire up the Fusion Reactor.
     
  5. Detritus Mulm

    Detritus Mulm Guru Class Expert

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    LOL, it's the Stock Tank I used to over-winter the Pond Fish in. Although I don't use it anymore, since I enlarged the pond. I call it a bucket more because of it's shape/use than it's size. I used the Hallide to grow some Water Hyacinths for the pond. Tanks are much smaller, a 75 with GF, a 55 Tropical (CO2), a 20 Tropical (CO2) and a 10 Shrimp Tank. Pond is about 800 gallons + 100 for filter.
     
  6. DaBub

    DaBub Guru Class Expert

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    300-Gallon Bucket=6600-Gallon Tank

    1000 watts!:)

    A thousand watts! :D

    Echinodorus ‘Ozelot’ is self-pollinating, I do not believe Echinodorus spp. in general are.

    shoggoth43 and inquiring minds everywhere are curious as to your definitions. If 300-gallons is a "bucket.” What size is your "tank"? :confused:

    Could there be a lurking threat that Detritus Mulm is morphing into an “Evil Plant Monster?”:eek:
     
  7. Detritus Mulm

    Detritus Mulm Guru Class Expert

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    We used to get the helicopters flying over when I was growing the Hyacinths. I think they were looking for a whole different kind of weed though. Fortunately we never had any midnight raids.

    I think Biollante is safe, unless he wants to have an Algae competition. :)
     
  8. Detritus Mulm

    Detritus Mulm Guru Class Expert

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    OK, read the article, bought my covered seed tray, soil and some fertilizer sticks. Next I was wondering how I was going to plant a 1000 seedlings right side up (only slight exageration). I definitely don't have the patience for tweezers. So I was thinking I could add just enough water to float the seedlings over the soil and as the water evapourated they would root themselves?

    Somewhat rhetorical, as I'm about to try it. :)
     
  9. LoudCreature

    LoudCreature Prolific Poster

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    I will smack Biollante to get an answer.

    I helped Biollante plant a bunch of seeds, it was a rich soil and I think we put 3 or 4 seeds in each area of roughed up soil.

    Then we roughed the soil over them, we kept them warm and moist. For the first couple of days we covered the trays.

    LC
     
  10. Biollante

    Biollante Lifetime Charter Member
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    He Said Rhetorical

    Hi,

    He said the question was rhetorical. :p

    We use cheap plastic planting trays with dome; designed to start 72 tomato plants.

    We use a rich soil of peat, worm poop and top soil (I just started one using Miracle Grow), with Gardner’s Choice, Vitamin B-1 (also contains boron, chelated iron, zinc and manganese) and Alaska Fish (5-1-1).

    We rough up the soil with a little hand rake then make 72 grids and drop 3 or 4 seeds per grid space. I cover the tray with some burlap for a couple of days, something I read somewhere, I do not know if it does any good.

    The first big trick is keeping the soil moist; it can be a fine line between moist (good) and wet (bad). We keep the tray warm.

    The second big trick is the humidity, it needs high (80 + %) keeping the temperature up seems to help. We remove the dome every third day and fan them. As far as lighting, it is pretty bright here and the area is lit by shop lights T-12, some T-8, generally 5500k and 6700k.

    They are slow starters; I do not think raising Echinodorus spp. from seed will replace propagating via adventitious plants, daughter plants.

    We seem to get around 60 transplantable.

    Biollante
     
  11. Detritus Mulm

    Detritus Mulm Guru Class Expert

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    Thanks, I'm sure he deserves it for some reason or other. :)

    Yeah, I think my soil choice was too 'Peaty', as it's rather floaty and sludgy. I was hoping to get the plantlets root down, but most seem to be wrong side up. Likely something to do with the aerodynamics of being flung from the net. Perhaps I should poke them under the sludge.
     
  12. Detritus Mulm

    Detritus Mulm Guru Class Expert

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    Conditions sound similar, except I'm dealing with a couple of tiny leaves and a root. A lot of them did not end up root down, not sure how much this will matter. Perhaps I should poke each one down a bit. My soil is definitely wetter than you describe, but I'm not dealing with seeds, as they've already germinated. I hardly put a dint in my supply of Guinea Pigs so a redo (or several) is always a possibility.

    I put the tray on top of the shrimp tank, so they should get some heat. The dome is covered in condensation, so an airing out may be in order. I bought a cheap clip on lamp and daylight CFL to provide some extra light.

    Thanks.
     
  13. Biollante

    Biollante Lifetime Charter Member
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    They Find Their Way Up

    Hi,

    [FONT=&quot]Echinodorus spp.[/FONT] seem to be able to figure out root direction pretty well. I do not think you will need to poke them down, in fact until things dry out a bit you may be better off with them up a bit.

    The main problems I have seen is root rot from being wet and the plant drying out, keeping the humidity up around here can be a difficult; it is dry (well most of the time) here. Good drainage and keeping the temperature up seems to work for me.

    I may over cull, but these are substantial plants, so I treat them like tomato plants and give them a good bit of space as they grow.

    I have only been aggressively propagating Echinodorus spp., for five months so I am hardly an expert. Over the years, I have grown a few species from seed, but only a few at a time. Like most folks, I have grown many emerged or emergent.

    A problem I had seen was similar to that a number of people have reported here, algae, cyanobacteria and so forth on the soil. I have read here and other places that K2HPO4 is an effective deterrent.

    I sprinkle a light dusting, sort of trying to follow the ‘grid line’ between the plants. Once a week I spray a weak solution of K2HPO4 over the plants and soil. Thus far, it seems to help, along with fanning the plants every three or so days, good drainage and keeping them warm.

    By the way thanks for hanging in there for me dear nephew, :( as if the Loud-Creature-What-Shares-My-Space needs any encouragement to violence, domestic or otherwise. :D

    Biollante
     
  14. shoggoth43

    shoggoth43 Lifetime Charter Member
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    I haven't found a need to do anything special for them to root. The floating plantlets have gotten tangled enough in the plants and the roots managed to find their way into the substrate all on their own. Whether or not the plant will essentially winch itself down into the soil on it's own I don't know. I ended up pulling them free as I want to make sure the flow around the bottom of the tank doesn't get too cluttered.

    -
    S
     
  15. Biollante

    Biollante Lifetime Charter Member
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    More Than One Way To Skin The proverbial Cat!

    Hi S,

    I think most of these plants do right themselves. I had understood from an earlier post the your plants were adventitious plants, daughter plants, rather than grown from seed.

    The daughter plants can also be grown emerged.

    I suspect that some number would grow from seed just left in water.

    Biollante
     
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