Antimicrobial Tubing - Helping to Prevent Algae, Biofilm, Microbe, Bacterial Buildup?

[Left C]

Biollante pointed out an important point. I deleted my post for the time being.

Thanks, Biollante!

 

[nipat]

No clear ? Doh!

 

[shoggoth43]

Well, I guess it would depend on flow rate and what you want to do with it? I know there was some concern on the Rubbermaid trash bins a while back. Some harm to corals, others have reported declines/crashes in their 'pod populations on their reef tanks where they've installed these Brute bins as sumps. Whether this is the cause is hard to say.

Based on that alone I would be less inclined to use this tubing on a spawning/grow-out tank. For adults or a main display this might be fine. It may also just be paranoia on this and the chemicals in this tubing may be completely harmless but what's "harmless" for one critter doesn't always hold over for others. Also, "harmless" doesn't always prove to be. Plenty of stuff causes problems but the damage may just not be obvious.

Found the link:

http://forum.marinedepot.com/Topic101230-9-1.aspx


-
S

 

[Left C]

No clear ? Doh!

You don't like the look of the silver colored tubing? I don't care for the blue tubing.

Anyway,Tygon does have two types of clear tubing that might help to keep organic buildup to a minimum. The features that I think will help with this function are underlined. The first one is:

Tygon® Food, Milk, & Dairy Tubing B-44-4X: http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23442&catid=864
Smooth, non-porous bore will not trap particulates or promote bacterial growth. Compatible with foods containing a high oil content. Resistant to harsh alkaline cleaners and sanitizers. Excellent alternative to rigid piping systems. Meets FDA, 3-A and NSF criteria. With its smooth, non-porous bore, helps ensure a bacterial-free fluid path in a wide variety of food processing applications. Producers of food, milk and dairy products insist upon Tygon® Food, Milk and Dairy Tubing for dependable performance in countless filling, draining, transfer and processing applications. Its smooth, non-porous bore inhibits particle entrapment, promoting a sanitary fluid path by minimizing potential for bacterial growth. It has outstanding resistance to harsh alkaline cleaners and is equally unaffected by commonly used sanitizers. Non-toxic, taste-free and odor-free, Tygon® Food, Milk and Dairy Tubing meets applicable regulatory standards for contact with food products. Complete clarity for positive visual inspection and flow control, it is available in up to a 6" inside diameter, making it a flexible replacement for rigid piping systems. Max working temp 165°F. Standard length is 50 ft.; priced per foot, sold in 10 ft. intervals only.


The next one is:

Tygon® Beverage Tubing B-44-3: http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23279&catid=864
The most widely specified clear, flexible tubing, Tygon® Beverage Tubing is frequently chosen for its taste and odor-free characteristics. Taste-free and odor-free. Non-wetting surface permits thorough cleaning and complete drainage. Broad chemical resistance to virtually all non-solvent chemicals. Lightweight and flexible for easy, quick installation. Meets FDA, 3-A and NSF criteria. Tygon® Beverage Tubing is specially formulated for transferring a wide variety of beverages including soft drinks, fruit juices, flavored teas and bottled water. In virtually all cases, Will not affect the taste or odor of product transferred through it, while its excellent non-wetting properties facilitate complete drainage and permit simple flush-cleaning. Many of the unique properties inherent to Tygon® Beverage Tubing also apply to a wide variety of complex applications ranging from fine cosmetic production to the dispensing of water-based printing inks found in the publishing industry. The versatility and proven performance of Tygon® Beverage Tubing has made it today's most widely specified clear, flexible plastic tubing. Max working temp 165°F. Standard length is 50'. Tubing is priced per foot; sold in 10 ft. intervals only.

 

[Left C]

Well, I guess it would depend on flow rate and what you want to do with it? I know there was some concern on the Rubbermaid trash bins a while back. Some harm to corals, others have reported declines/crashes in their 'pod populations on their reef tanks where they've installed these Brute bins as sumps. Whether this is the cause is hard to say.

Based on that alone I would be less inclined to use this tubing on a spawning/grow-out tank. For adults or a main display this might be fine. It may also just be paranoia on this and the chemicals in this tubing may be completely harmless but what's "harmless" for one critter doesn't always hold over for others. Also, "harmless" doesn't always prove to be. Plenty of stuff causes problems but the damage may just not be obvious.

Found the link:

http://forum.marinedepot.com/Topic101230-9-1.aspx


-
S

Seious concern and interesting link! The two types of tubing that I just listed above (Beverage B-44-4X and Food, Milk, & Dairy B-44-3) may address your concerns. They have many features that you may like. Their smooth bores and non-wetting surfaces may be enough to help to keep the "funk" from sticking to our filter tubing without resorting to chemical means.

 

[nipat]

You don't like the look of the silver colored tubing? I don't care for the blue tubing.

Well, no, even the silver one. I imagine in real use it would look too heavy, different feeling
from a beautiful clean line of stainless steel tube.

Anyway,Tygon does have two types of clear tubing that might to keep organic buildup to a minimum. The features that I think will help with this function is underlined.>>

Ahh thanks for good information. Pricing is very good.

 

[Left C]

Well, no, even the silver one. I imagine in real use it would look too heavy, different feeling
from a beautiful clean line of stainless steel tube.

The color grey (or silver) is highly variable. Some clash with each other and some work well with each other. I used to be a colorist years ago and the color grey can be a real 'bugger' to get right sometimes.

The part that I don't like is that there are no 5/8" (16/22mm) versions.

Ahh thanks for good information. Pricing is very good.

Both of those clear tubing types come is many sizes. Just reading about them would make us think that they would help to prevent organic/dirt buildup plus address shoggoth43's concerns as well.

 

[Biollante]

A Note of Caution

Hi Left C, All,


I am with Shoggoth43; my principle concern is the use of ionic silver, which is water-soluble.



Ionic silver sometimes referred to as colloidal silver, in at least one study[SUP]1[/SUP] showed the silver ion 48 hour median lethal concentration (LC50[SUB]48[/SUB]) is 0.025-ppm for Zebrafish, Danio rerio.


Zebrafish I would hasten to point out are a rather hardy critter.

I will grant the ionic silver used in the study is Silver nitrate, AgNO[SUB]3[/SUB] and

• I do not know the form used on the tubing, never the less,
• Silver is an effective biocide,
  
• superior I believe to Copper..

I urge caution.:gw



Biollante
[SUP]1[/SUP]In vivo toxicity of silver nanoparticles and silver ions in zebrafish (Danio rerio)

Katrine Bilberg, Mads B. Hovgaard, Flemming Besenbacher and Erik Baatrup

 

[Left C]

Thanks, Biollante!

I had forgotten about some of the aspects of heavy metals. I felt it best to delete my post for the time being.

Left C

 

[Biollante]

Left C's Real Reason For Having An Aquarium

Hi Left C,

Silver is funny stuff toxicity-wise.:gw



Silver is almost as noble as Gold…



This means it is okay for you to use your aquarium as a place to hide your silver and gold bars along with the diamond, rubies and sapphires.



The problem from the fish keeping point of view occurs when our silver loses an electron it is then positively a biocide.

It also turns out that silver broken into very small as in nanometer size are toxic though ionic silver is still at least four times as toxic.

I have read ionic silver is effectively 10 times as toxic. So we use ionic silver as a biocide because we can get away with using much less silver.


Biollante

 

[Left C]

I'll just keep my jewels and gold buried. I'll shy away from metals like silver, copper and nickle. I'm allergic to nickle.

I believe that I will shy away from any of those silver ion tubing products too, but I may try one of the clear, odor-free tubing products with their smooth, non-porous, non-wetting bores that will not trap particles or promote bacterial growth. These may do a good job. I already like the lab tubing for CO[sub]2[/sub] use.
filter/pump tubing: http://www.tygon.com/uploadedFiles/SGtygon/Documents/Tygon_Tubing/Tygon-B443-Beverage-Tubing.pdf
filter/pump tubing: http://www.tygon.com/uploadedFiles/SGtygon/Documents/Tygon_Tubing/Tygon-B444X-Food-Tubing.pdf
CO[sub]2[/sub] tubing: http://www.tygon.com/uploadedFiles/SGtygon/Documents/Tygon_Tubing/Tygon-R3603-Lab-Tubing.pdf

Thank you again, Biollante!

 

[shoggoth43]

Out of curiosity, what makes it non-wetting? Some treatment? Physical structure of the tubing ( such as something like "Moth Eyes" )? Just the nature of Tygon?

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S

 

[Left C]

Out of curiosity, what makes it non-wetting? Some treatment? Physical structure of the tubing ( such as something like "Moth Eyes" )? Just the nature of Tygon?

-
S

I really don't know for sure. It could be a physical characteristic of the polymer used, the extruding process, a chemical coating, etc. I know that there are many versions of Tygon tubing. Saint-Gobain is the parent company. USPlastics.com is one of the companies that sells it. I wish that I could tell you more, shoggoth. I've been reading about the many versions of Tygon tubing and wondering if any could help to improve any specific aspects of the tubing that we use for our pumps, canister filters and CO[SUB]2[/SUB] other than just being a flow transport mechanism. This is why I originally and unintentionally went down the wrong path with the silver ion coating. Gunk buildup in our tubing is unsightly, a real problem and sometimes a PITA to clean. I was just wondering if there is a better mouse trap, so to speak.

 

[shoggoth43]

It is a touch impractical to pig the lines and most of our plumbing was never setup to do so. Essentially a slightly oversized foam or rubber plug run through to physically scrape all the crud off, but a brush on a cord will do the same, it's just a lot of work. I don't know how much light affects the process of buildup. It might be why eheim uses the dark green tubing. Less light for less buildup, more likely it's a case of less light means people don't see it.

-
S

 

[Biollante]

> 90 Angle = Non-Wetting

Hi,


It is real smooth…


It has to do with “contact angle.” Wetting and non-wetting is defined by the contact angle, theta.


At the risk of citing someone selling something, this is a good explanation from Attension a product organizations of Biolin Scientific group.



Biollante