This site is supported by the advertisements on it, please disable your AdBlocker so we can continue to provide you with the quality content you expect.
  1. We are after as many aquarium plant images that we can get, doing so will assist us in completing the aquarium plant database.

    https://barrreport.com/threads/aquatic-plant-images-wanted.14374/
    Dismiss Notice

120 gallon Dutch Planted something or another

Discussion in 'Aquascaping' started by Tom Barr, Jan 5, 2012.

  1. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    You can view the past post etc, plenty of how to there.
     
  2. PK1

    PK1 Guru Class Expert

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2005
    Messages:
    154
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Tom,

    To be clear, does your 8 hour photoperiod include the 90 min of amp up + 90 min of amp down, meaning a total of 3 hours at less than 100% intensity and 5 hours of max intensity? Or did you mean you amp up for 90 minutes, run at full intensity for 8 hours and then amp down?
     
  3. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Yes

    No, not this
     
  4. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Yes

    No, not this
     
  5. Whiskey

    Whiskey Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2010
    Messages:
    368
    Likes Received:
    1
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Wow! That's higher than I expected. I'm curious,.. I've done allot of searching on PAR numbers and found some fantastic threads,.. like the ADA light level thread you posted, many of your larger tanks, a 450G rainbow tank on a UK board, some of your client tanks, and of course Hoppy's work. It seems like you (and many others) typically fall in the 40-55 micromol range for light. Why did you decide to go for the higher level of light here?

    What did you do to compensate for the higher light? Did you need to run a higher level of CO2? Or is this a case where you just need to be more exact about even distribution and delivery to make sure all the plants are always getting their 40ppm?

    Why did you decide on 5 hours for full Intensity? Does the higher light makes them done for the day sooner, and lower light needs a longer photoperiod? Or is that just the extent of the time you wanted it on?

    Thank you!
    Whiskey
     
    #505 Whiskey, Sep 14, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 14, 2013
  6. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    I chose higher light since this is a high light tank.
    Nothing too deep here in the rational.:very_drunk:

    The CO2 is a tad less in this tank than the deeper 180.
    This is mostly for the fish being more touchy than the Cardinals and pleco species in the 120 vs the 180.
    8-10 hour seems fine for most species, they close up after 6-7 hours.
     
  7. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    I chose higher light since this is a high light tank.
    Nothing too deep here in the rational.:very_drunk:

    The CO2 is a tad less in this tank than the deeper 180.
    This is mostly for the fish being more touchy than the Cardinals and pleco species in the 120 vs the 180.
    8-10 hour seems fine for most species, they close up after 6-7 hours.
     
  8. Whiskey

    Whiskey Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2010
    Messages:
    368
    Likes Received:
    1
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Well,.. It is hard to argue with that logic.

    Out of curiosity,.. How much CO2 does the 120 use? Like how many BPS? And how about the 180?

    Thank you!
    Whiskey
     
  9. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Volume of CO2 is about 1 ml per second.
    Note, this is a real unit of volume, not some horse manure unit ADA cooked up(bubbles per second, as if that is some standard method that is equal across the world).
    ADA's tubing and bubbles are not all the same sizes, they cannot be.

    Counting per second is a tough unit of time.

    Counts per 5 minutes, that's MUCH better.
    So mine is about 300mls collected in 5 minutes(300 seconds).
     
  10. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Volume of CO2 is about 1 ml per second.
    Note, this is a real unit of volume, not some horse manure unit ADA cooked up(bubbles per second, as if that is some standard method that is equal across the world).
    ADA's tubing and bubbles are not all the same sizes, they cannot be.

    Counting per second is a tough unit of time.

    Counts per 5 minutes, that's MUCH better.
    So mine is about 300mls collected in 5 minutes(300 seconds).
     
  11. Whiskey

    Whiskey Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2010
    Messages:
    368
    Likes Received:
    1
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    This really is a brilliant idea, much more accurate than trying to count bubbles when you get to a larger tank. I'm going to rig something up today to measure mine as well - I'm curious where I am at.

    Whiskey
     
  12. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Not my idea, just a simple method to measure gas production or flow rate.
    We use this same method to measure yeast CO2 production in various treatments, like a range of temps, sugar types, pH's or salt concentrations.
    Test tubes are used to measure the CO2 production in mls per unit time to compare the treatments.

    Very simple and cheap.
    Not sure why other hobbyists have not come up with it.
    Mass flow controllers will do a similar thing, but cost 1200$.
    You can use the collection flask method to verify the flow rates through the mass flow controllers, they are dead on accurate.

    Then, much like PAR measurements, you can use the rate of CO2 and scale up or down. Or at least get pretty close.
     
  13. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Not my idea, just a simple method to measure gas production or flow rate.
    We use this same method to measure yeast CO2 production in various treatments, like a range of temps, sugar types, pH's or salt concentrations.
    Test tubes are used to measure the CO2 production in mls per unit time to compare the treatments.

    Very simple and cheap.
    Not sure why other hobbyists have not come up with it.
    Mass flow controllers will do a similar thing, but cost 1200$.
    You can use the collection flask method to verify the flow rates through the mass flow controllers, they are dead on accurate.

    Then, much like PAR measurements, you can use the rate of CO2 and scale up or down. Or at least get pretty close.
     
  14. Whiskey

    Whiskey Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2010
    Messages:
    368
    Likes Received:
    1
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Your right about that BPS thing, what looks like a stream of bubbles where I can't tell one from the other in the bubble counter turned out to be about 1.5 BPS from the slightly oversized airline tube running into my tank.

    From there it turned into 200 ML in 10 min, or about 20 ML/Min.

    This means that your tank, with far more light is using far more CO2. This is to be expected I suppose, and it could be due to a thousand other factors as well, but I was curious anyway.

    How long does a 5LB CO2 tank last you?

    Whiskey
     
  15. Whiskey

    Whiskey Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2010
    Messages:
    368
    Likes Received:
    1
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    It's too bad those mass flow controllers are so expensive. I could see hooking up a reef controller to a mass flow controller to inject CO2 by quantity/hour. So you set the needle valve a little high and it cycles the silanoid every 5 min or so to get it dead on.

    We could then be far more accurate about how much we are putting in, and have less chance of gassing our fish.

    Whiskey
     
  16. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Did some hacking again today, mowed some groups down and added the Red ludwigia back, then swapped the mini A reneckii for the R. macrandra, this produces a deeper darker red and a bright vibrant red contrast, rather than overloading one side too much with one or the other shades of red.

    Using 1 red plant in a scape is one level, using 2, another, using 5-7, quite another matter. I'm happy with this grouping and I know it'll last for sometime.
    the Green plants, I would like more erect stem like than the prostrate downoi and Erios, but, they are nice also.

    The Type 3 Erio setaceum are very nice, but touchy to do over a year or two in this tank. Need a taller tank basically. L gigentea, or what is called that, is a good replacement, but so so weedy(2x a week hackings required).
    I have a fair amount of the E. hydropiper, so I could redo the foreground, but I'll wait till this group of weeds fills in and then decide.

    I think I have about 2 more weeks now till the tank is where I want.
    Then I'll go back to the stemy stuff and add the E hydropiper again.
    After a few weeks, couple of months, I'll see where I'm at.

    Likely will redo the tank/hardscape entirely at that point.
     
  17. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Did some hacking again today, mowed some groups down and added the Red ludwigia back, then swapped the mini A reneckii for the R. macrandra, this produces a deeper darker red and a bright vibrant red contrast, rather than overloading one side too much with one or the other shades of red.

    Using 1 red plant in a scape is one level, using 2, another, using 5-7, quite another matter. I'm happy with this grouping and I know it'll last for sometime.
    the Green plants, I would like more erect stem like than the prostrate downoi and Erios, but, they are nice also.

    The Type 3 Erio setaceum are very nice, but touchy to do over a year or two in this tank. Need a taller tank basically. L gigentea, or what is called that, is a good replacement, but so so weedy(2x a week hackings required).
    I have a fair amount of the E. hydropiper, so I could redo the foreground, but I'll wait till this group of weeds fills in and then decide.

    I think I have about 2 more weeks now till the tank is where I want.
    Then I'll go back to the stemy stuff and add the E hydropiper again.
    After a few weeks, couple of months, I'll see where I'm at.

    Likely will redo the tank/hardscape entirely at that point.
     
  18. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    No, you do not need a solenoid or a a valve, the controller only allows a precise amount of gas through.
    I use these with a MFC, but they are not required, part of the functionality is they replace a few different things.
     
  19. Tom Barr

    Tom Barr Founder
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,691
    Likes Received:
    711
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    No, you do not need a solenoid or a a valve, the controller only allows a precise amount of gas through.
    I use these with a MFC, but they are not required, part of the functionality is they replace a few different things.
     
  20. reef12

    reef12 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Messages:
    534
    Likes Received:
    0
    Local Time:
    4:25 AM
    Looking good and when that Downoi is ready for sale put my name on the list. LOL:p

    Jeff
     
Loading...

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice