Sump Maintenance and Cerges Operation

Gerryd

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Hey all,

Here is a vid showing simple maintenance of the wet/dry and how quick it is. I also show the cerges operation.

I hope you can see the c02 bubbles in the cerges unit towards the end of the video..

I will post one later of the tank outlet both with and w/o the cerges connected and you will see the difference in visible mist.

Later

[video=youtube;CnZHiC4rGgM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnZHiC4rGgM&feature=youtu.be[/video]
 

Tom Barr

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I do not even use the filter pads. I just use a sponge block.
 

Gerryd

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Tom Barr;123210 said:
I do not even use the filter pads. I just use a sponge block.

Yep. I like the pads as they are quick to replace...the micron pads and the coarser blue stuff come in big sheets. use the microns all day after a water change and the water really is clear.

sponges alone work too..

- - - Updated - - -

Tom Barr;123210 said:
I do not even use the filter pads. I just use a sponge block.

Yep. I like the pads as they are quick to replace...the micron pads and the coarser blue stuff come in big sheets. use the microns all day after a water change and the water really is clear.

sponges alone work too..
 

jerrybforl

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Gerry you gave me an idea on my DIY sump that I will be making. I will use a drawer like yours. I will cute some acrylic and use weldon to glue it together.
 

antbug

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Nice video and that's a cool wet/dry for cleaning, but I doubt your towel is doing anything for the co2. That part made me chuckle. Looking more at your sump, I don't see how you could seal it.

Why do you have the rio 1000 to the reactor and them back to the sump pump. Wouldn't the sump pump to the reactor do the same and you now have less equipment? I guess I see why you do this, but does it really help that much more? I'm looking to add a reactor to mine and I'm hoping it will reduce the bubbles by 75%. I'd be happy with that.
 

Gerryd

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Hi,

Well, the sump pump is NOT a needle wheel and I did not want to mod the impeller. This works well for me and provides a bit more diffusion as the reactor output again goes thru the sump pump and on out. Adds a few more secs/feet to the travel time...

The towel thing was a joke in terms of c02 loss. More for the noise and to show folks how NOT to complicate things...

- - - Updated - - -

Hi,

Well, the sump pump is NOT a needle wheel and I did not want to mod the impeller. This works well for me and provides a bit more diffusion as the reactor output again goes thru the sump pump and on out. Adds a few more secs/feet to the travel time...

The towel thing was a joke in terms of c02 loss. More for the noise and to show folks how NOT to complicate things...
 

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antbug;123347 said:
Nice video and that's a cool wet/dry for cleaning, but I doubt your towel is doing anything for the co2. That part made me chuckle. Looking more at your sump, I don't see how you could seal it.

Why do you have the rio 1000 to the reactor and them back to the sump pump. Wouldn't the sump pump to the reactor do the same and you now have less equipment? I guess I see why you do this, but does it really help that much more? I'm looking to add a reactor to mine and I'm hoping it will reduce the bubbles by 75%. I'd be happy with that.

I have that same set up on my 180, and no mist is there really.
The 120 and the 70 gallon have less room in the sump area for another powerhead, and they are fed pretty much main line in the return pump, even with the post Cerges catch filters, there's still ample mist coming in.
 

Tom Barr

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antbug;123347 said:
Nice video and that's a cool wet/dry for cleaning, but I doubt your towel is doing anything for the co2. That part made me chuckle. Looking more at your sump, I don't see how you could seal it.

Why do you have the rio 1000 to the reactor and them back to the sump pump. Wouldn't the sump pump to the reactor do the same and you now have less equipment? I guess I see why you do this, but does it really help that much more? I'm looking to add a reactor to mine and I'm hoping it will reduce the bubbles by 75%. I'd be happy with that.

I have that same set up on my 180, and no mist is there really.
The 120 and the 70 gallon have less room in the sump area for another powerhead, and they are fed pretty much main line in the return pump, even with the post Cerges catch filters, there's still ample mist coming in.
 

fablau

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Very nice video Gerry, thank you.

I also use the micron pad in my sump, but to avoid "clogging" it too fast, I make some holes (1/2 inch) randomly on the pad when I use a new one; that way it last much longer and cleans the water anyway.

Weird thing I have noticed, you put the blue/white pad with the blue part at the top. I do exactly the opposite, because I think the white part is supposed to be the "coarse" side... Am I right? What's the best way to put it?

Thanks again, this really will help me with a similar cerges installation I want to pursue.
 

Gerryd

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Tom Barr;123352 said:
I have that same set up on my 180, and no mist is there really.
The 120 and the 70 gallon have less room in the sump area for another powerhead, and they are fed pretty much main line in the return pump, even with the post Cerges catch filters, there's still ample mist coming in.

The results on your smaller tanks is what keeps me using the same setup on all 3 tanks.

On the 220, I am thinking of changing things somewhat:

1. Use a true NW pump and discharge directly into the path of the twin sump pumps.
2. Install a large cerges on EACH return line.

This config means much more flow thru the cerges and increasing from 5/8 to 1" tubing. I am concerned that this may result in more mist than I have now (not much at all hardly) which is not what I want.

But, I can always revert and use the second cerges simply as a filter...

Have to say this method works well if you have the sump room. That said, for small sumps, you do not need a large NW pump. Get creative and stick it to the side instead of the bottom for example :) I did this and the footprint was less.

I removed the nozzle flares on the rios first and connect tubing directly to it. It is fine to have a longer connection to/from the cerges as that provides more dwell time.

Glad this vid helped some folks.

JJ, keep us posted on your sump project. The drawer idea I have seen before using the Rubbermaid or whatever brand of chest/drawers you use.

- - - Updated - - -

Tom Barr;123352 said:
I have that same set up on my 180, and no mist is there really.
The 120 and the 70 gallon have less room in the sump area for another powerhead, and they are fed pretty much main line in the return pump, even with the post Cerges catch filters, there's still ample mist coming in.

The results on your smaller tanks is what keeps me using the same setup on all 3 tanks.

On the 220, I am thinking of changing things somewhat:

1. Use a true NW pump and discharge directly into the path of the twin sump pumps.
2. Install a large cerges on EACH return line.

This config means much more flow thru the cerges and increasing from 5/8 to 1" tubing. I am concerned that this may result in more mist than I have now (not much at all hardly) which is not what I want.

But, I can always revert and use the second cerges simply as a filter...

Have to say this method works well if you have the sump room. That said, for small sumps, you do not need a large NW pump. Get creative and stick it to the side instead of the bottom for example :) I did this and the footprint was less.

I removed the nozzle flares on the rios first and connect tubing directly to it. It is fine to have a longer connection to/from the cerges as that provides more dwell time.

Glad this vid helped some folks.

JJ, keep us posted on your sump project. The drawer idea I have seen before using the Rubbermaid or whatever brand of chest/drawers you use.
 

antbug

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Apr 4, 2011
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Tom Barr;123353 said:
I have that same set up on my 180, and no mist is there really.
The 120 and the 70 gallon have less room in the sump area for another powerhead, and they are fed pretty much main line in the return pump, even with the post Cerges catch filters, there's still ample mist coming in.

Good point on the room. I don't think I have it for another pump. Ample mist is better that what I have going on now so I think I will still try one of these.

Would feeding the co2 line in the reactor be better that the the sump pump for less mist? The pump chops up the bubbles and I would think the smaller bubble are more likely to get past the reactor. Thoughts?
 

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antbug;123363 said:
Good point on the room. I don't think I have it for another pump. Ample mist is better that what I have going on now so I think I will still try one of these.

Would feeding the co2 line in the reactor be better that the the sump pump for less mist? The pump chops up the bubbles and I would think the smaller bubble are more likely to get past the reactor. Thoughts?

If the mist comes back into the sump, then some or most will dissolve or degas, if it heads into the return pump with a post Cerges collector ......then you will have maybe 30% the mist that you might without the Cerges collector.
If you have a sump based system and a cerges collector, then you have virtually no mist.


If you add a nice deep bubble counter inlet tube for the Cerges(why the heck do we just not call it a water filter housing?), and use it like a a normal cO2 reactor, then have a dual venturi line go back to the return pump, then you have about the best of both worlds, no need for extra space or another pump, little mist in the tank except a bit late in the day(say 30% vs main lining with a cerge reactor catch).

Some mist is okay, but you only need it for a hour or two, not all day really.
 

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antbug;123363 said:
Good point on the room. I don't think I have it for another pump. Ample mist is better that what I have going on now so I think I will still try one of these.

Would feeding the co2 line in the reactor be better that the the sump pump for less mist? The pump chops up the bubbles and I would think the smaller bubble are more likely to get past the reactor. Thoughts?

If the mist comes back into the sump, then some or most will dissolve or degas, if it heads into the return pump with a post Cerges collector ......then you will have maybe 30% the mist that you might without the Cerges collector.
If you have a sump based system and a cerges collector, then you have virtually no mist.


If you add a nice deep bubble counter inlet tube for the Cerges(why the heck do we just not call it a water filter housing?), and use it like a a normal cO2 reactor, then have a dual venturi line go back to the return pump, then you have about the best of both worlds, no need for extra space or another pump, little mist in the tank except a bit late in the day(say 30% vs main lining with a cerge reactor catch).

Some mist is okay, but you only need it for a hour or two, not all day really.
 

jerrybforl

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Tom Barr;123353 said:
I have that same set up on my 180, and no mist is there really.
The 120 and the 70 gallon have less room in the sump area for another powerhead, and they are fed pretty much main line in the return pump, even with the post Cerges catch filters, there's still ample mist coming in.

Tom I have a cerges also and was wanting to run it inline. My only question is will the sump pump be too much for the reactor? It's a Deep Blue Trition 4 which is 1050gph. I have a 3/4" ball valve on it already to reduce flow.

My concern is that this will push the CO2 right through leaving it no dwell time in the cerges. Or should I just run two separate pumps...one for the sump and one for the reactor???
 

jerrybforl

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JJ, keep us posted on your sump project. The drawer idea I have seen before using the Rubbermaid or whatever brand of chest/drawers you use.

Gerry I will. I am going to use one of those drawers too along with a 20 gallon. I think this will work well for me and be on the cheap side lol. It will also be easy to modify it since it's plastic.

- - - Updated - - -

JJ, keep us posted on your sump project. The drawer idea I have seen before using the Rubbermaid or whatever brand of chest/drawers you use.

Gerry I will. I am going to use one of those drawers too along with a 20 gallon. I think this will work well for me and be on the cheap side lol. It will also be easy to modify it since it's plastic.
 

fablau

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Gerry, I have installed a cerges into my system pretty much like yours, but I am still using the am1000 reactor instead of a needle wheel pump.

The mist has been reduced a big deal, which is great!

I am posting a couple of picture below:

uge3ytus.jpg


e2eheren.jpg



Thank you for all your help on this, I couldn't ever do it!
 

AaronT

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Nice idea to use the micron pad for polishing after water changes. Is it safe to assume these can be washed and reused like the filter socks can? I was contemplating incorporating sock filters into my sump build, but I'm not sold on the idea of having to change them out every few days. This seems like a nice compromise.

I'm with you on the filter pads too. I've tried using Poret and it doesn't catch as much as the pads do.
 

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Farmhand;123547 said:
Does not the wet/dry filter cause a lot of Co2 to be lost. Or does this not matter? Please explain.

The Dry section is sealed up with tape, so there's not venting where the water enters the sump. This leaves the overflow as the main source of noise and degassing, but a well designed "bean animal" overflow, or variation thereof, takes care of that real fast.